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[Bojji]

White Red Devil planned

https://videocardz.com/newz/powercolor-preparing-radeon-rx-7650-gre-reaper-spectral-white-edition-white-rx-9070-xt-red-devil-also-planned

Should be called White Devil

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Wafers at TSMC are bought several months in advance. And the same for all other companies.
The amount of left over wafers that a company can buy on short notice is very small.

This has nothing to do with the point I was making

 

[winjer]

This has nothing to do with the point I was making

You probably think that buying wafers at TSMC is like an auction house. It's not.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

You probably think that buying wafers at TSMC is like an auction house. It's not.

You probably think that TSMC sells wafers to buyers who have less money to pay out of charity. They don't

Apple, Qualcomm, Nvidia get what they want first. In Apple's case, they can buy out the entire year's production of a specific node if they feel like it and they have in the past. Companies like AMD and Intel only get capacity after the big boys have made their reservations

 

[winjer]

You probably think that TSMC sells wafers to buyers who have less money to pay out of charity. They don't

Apple, Qualcomm, Nvidia get what they want first. In Apple's case, they can buy out the entire year's production of a specific node if they feel like it and they have in the past. Companies like AMD and Intel only get capacity after the big boys have made their reservations

That is incorrect. And it's easy to verify that AMD has had plenty of wafers before and after the mining and covid craze.
The company that really gets first pick of TSMC process node is usually Apple. Because they fork out a lot of money to invest in them.
And that partnership has been going on for nearly a decade.

The reality is that TSMC has standardize prices, and a tiered discount system, based on amount ordered.
And unless, a company has a dumbass of a CEO that insults Taiwan and loses it's 40% discount rate, all companies are treated in a similar fashion.

Besides, during the 2020 era, nvidia wasn't even making their GPUs at TSMC. It was at Samsung.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

That is incorrect. And it's easy to verify that AMD has had plenty of wafers before and after the mining and covid craze.
The company that really gets first pick of TSMC process node is usually Apple. Because they fork out a lot of money to invest in them.
And that partnership has been going on for nearly a decade.

The reality is that TSMC has standardize prices, and a tiered discount system, based on amount ordered.
And unless, a company has a dumbass of a CEO that insults Taiwan and loses it's 40% discount rate, all companies are treated in a similar fashion.

Besides, during the 2020 era, nvidia wasn't even making their GPUs at TSMC. It was at Samsung.

You literally just admitted what I said. They give discounts the more you order. Who has the ability to order more? That's right, the companies who have more money and can pay for it. Apple gets first dibs, because yes they can order the largest volume and they always order the most every year. That's how it works

Qualcomm also orders a huge volume, followed by Nvidia and Mediatek. Both AMD and Intel are comparatively tiny fish, only having a small volume to fulfill and therefore they go last. There is a pecking order whether you pretend there isn't or not

Nvidia actually got offered a great price to have Ampere made on Samsung but like everyone else who tried Samsung (Qualcomm did too) they found Samsung simply couldn't produce a competitive product and both Nvidia and Qualcomm went back to TSMC

Samsung Semiconductor is eating serious shit right now, they have been completely unable to produce Samsung's in-house Exynos SoC on their own inferior nodes and Samsung has been forced to keep using Qualcomm instead of their own product for their phones. It's so bad that apparently Samsung is even having to rely on Micron for the DRAM modules in the Galaxy S25 series instead of using Samsung's own DRAM modules. It's really, really bad for Samsung Semiconductor these days

 

[winjer]

You literally just admitted what I said. They give discounts the more you order. Who has the ability to order more? That's right, the companies who have more money and can pay for it. Apple gets first dibs, because yes they can order the largest volume and they always order the most every year. That's how it works

Qualcomm also orders a huge volume, followed by Nvidia and Mediatek. Both AMD and Intel are comparatively tiny fish, only having a small volume to fulfill and therefore they go last. There is a pecking order whether you pretend there isn't or not

Nvidia actually got offered a great price to have Ampere made on Samsung but like everyone else who tried Samsung (Qualcomm did too) they found Samsung simply couldn't produce a competitive product and both Nvidia and Qualcomm went back to TSMC

AMD is one of the biggest clients for TSMC wafers. Not far behind the likes of Nvidia.

As of 2024, TSMC's largest clients by revenue contribution are:

1. Apple: Approximately 25.2% of TSMC's annual revenue.
2. NVIDIA: Around 10.1% of TSMC's annual revenue.
3. MediaTek: Contributing about 9.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
4. AMD: Accounting for approximately 8.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
5. Qualcomm: Representing around 7.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
6. Broadcom: Contributing about 6.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
7. Sony: Accounting for approximately 5.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
8. Marvell Technology: Representing around 4.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
9. Advanced Micro Devices (AMD): Contributing about 3.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.
10. Qualcomm: Accounting for approximately 2.5% of TSMC's annual revenue.

 

[FingerBang]

I'm following the developments here (a little anyway, with my very limited tech knowledge). My current rig is over 10 years old with only a mid-life cycle upgrade to a Nvidia 1080 base GPU. Any upgrade will be huge for me, but I'm not looking to break bank and I don't care about high-end performance. I brought up getting a new rig to a much more knowledgeable friend of mine who suggested waiting for the new AMD models next month. My hope is that they'll be midrange that can compete on price and availability against Nvidia's equivalent (we'll see I guess).

He told me that years ago AMD's drivers were kinda shit and so compatibility was a problem but that this has apparently improved. I'm curious if anyone with experience can testify as to their experience with newer AMD cards. My googling/chatgpting suggest AMD's drivers have gotten better for mainstream gaming and emulation.

Since any update is going to be massive for you, there are 3 key questions:

What kind of games do you play?

What kind of resolution do you target?

What is your budget?

Because it all comes down to that, the situation is a bit shit at the moment, with stuff being impossible to find at MSRP (whatever it means). Still, in the end, there are too many variables to be able to recommend one card over the other. I would recommend waiting for AMD to show their hand because we're close, and there is some great potential. In the worst-case scenario, you score something like a 7800XT for a reasonable price.

 

[Buggy Loop]

So is this back to monolith design? Really didn't follow the rumours too much on this

 

[Unknown Soldier]

AMD is one of the biggest clients for TSMC wafers. Not far behind the likes of Nvidia.

What an interesting chart you posted where somehow AMD is both #4 and #9

You should look at what AI generates for you before you post it

 

[winjer]

What an interesting chart you posted where somehow AMD is both #4 and #9

You should look at what AI generates for you before you post it

Ok, then here is an article with the top 3 clients for TSMC in 2023. Apple, Nvidia and AMD.
Complain all you want, but AMD is one of the top clients for TSMC.

TSMC's top 3 customers in 2023: Apple with 25%, NVIDIA with 11%, and AMD with 7%

TSMC's top 7 customers in 2023 consisted of Apple, NVIDIA, AMD, Qualcomm, MediaTek, Broadcom, Intel, and others. Apple provided 25% of revenue in 2023.

www.tweaktown.com

This is for 2022:

TSMC’s top-10/20/30/40 customers; Who spends how much on TSMC? Apple revenue; Top-10 customer dynamics

TSMC, the world's largest semiconductor foundry, served 532 customers in 2022. However, its top-10 customers accounted for 68% of its revenue. Apple, the largest customer, accounted for 23% of TSMC's revenue. In this post, I address which company contributed how much income to TSMC, the top-10...

exploresemis.substack.com

And for 2020:

AMD Zen 3 '4000 Series' Processors And 600 Series Chipset Landing In Late 2020, Getting USB 4.0

It is a brand new year and its time for some brand new leaks. This one comes from Electronic Times and they claim that AMD's 600-series chipsets will be landing near the end of 2020. The 600-series chipsets will not only support USB 3.2 but 4.0 as well. The new chipset is designed for Zen 3...

wccftech.com

TSMC is expecting AMD to become the largest customer on its 7nm process node this year (it is currently no. 4 on the list).

 

[CrustyBritches]

Those leaked benchmarks are very promising. Now we just need fair pricing and more importantly actual availability.

To me $500 for 9070 and $600 for 9070 XT would be fair, with the premium AIB OC models going for $50 more.

 

[StereoVsn]

Those leaked benchmarks are very promising. Now we just need fair pricing and more importantly actual availability.

To me $500 for 9070 and $600 for 9070 XT would be fair, with the premium AIB OC models going for $50 more.

That means AMD will price $100-200 more than reasonable.

 

[CrustyBritches]

That means AMD will price $100-200 more than reasonable.

You mean $600 is $200 too much, or that they’ll target $700-800?

Hopefully delaying it until the 5070 launch could be a sign that they intend to sandwich that card.

 

[KeplerL2]

You probably think that TSMC sells wafers to buyers who have less money to pay out of charity. They don't

Apple, Qualcomm, Nvidia get what they want first. In Apple's case, they can buy out the entire year's production of a specific node if they feel like it and they have in the past. Companies like AMD and Intel only get capacity after the big boys have made their reservations

When has NVIDIA ever been first to a new node?

 

[StereoVsn]

You mean $600 is $200 too much, or that they’ll target $700-800?

Hopefully delaying it until the 5070 launch could be a sign that they intend to sandwich that card.

Yeah, I mean that AMD is going to price it higher than they should, following their “Nvidia -$50” strategy.

 

[SolidQ]

WMMA RDNA4

RDNA 4 における WMMA 命令と改善 | Coelacanth's Dream

RDNA 3/GFX11 アーキテクチャ からサポートされている WMMA (Wave Matrix Multiply-accumulate) 命令だが、RDNA 4/GFX12 アーキテクチャ でも引き続きサポートしており、そして対応フォーマットの追加や対応する行列レイア

www.coelacanth-dream.com

 

[grvg]

An interesting factor for current year is that the traditional amd strategy of nvidia msrp -50 nowadays translates to nvidia actual price -200 to 400

 

[SolidQ]

3.25GHZ 330W

i'd assuming Nitro or Red devil further OC

 

[Celcius]

I know AMD said they're not going to compete with nvidia on the high end anymore but is there any chance of at least one card above the 9070XT with more than 16gb VRAM?

 

[Gaiff]

I know AMD said they're not going to compete with nvidia on the high end anymore but is there any chance of at least one card above the 9070XT with more than 16gb VRAM?

Nah.

 

[StereoVsn]

Nah.

Maybe they will release one in a year against Nvidia’s inevitable 5080 and 5070Ti Super releases.

 

[kiphalfton]

Those leaked benchmarks are very promising. Now we just need fair pricing and more importantly actual availability.

To me $500 for 9070 and $600 for 9070 XT would be fair, with the premium AIB OC models going for $50 more.

I never keep track of AMD AOB partner prices. But is it really generally $50 more. I ask as Nvidia AIB partners upcharge the hell out of their stuff.

 

[kiphalfton]

That means AMD will price $100-200 more than reasonable.

expectations vs reality.

Every.single.time.

 

[CrustyBritches]

I never keep track of AMD AOB partner prices. But is it really generally $50 more. I ask as Nvidia AIB partners upcharge the hell out of their stuff.

When I bought my PowerColor RX 480 8GB Red Devil it was $259, while the shitty AMD reference blower model was $229.

I quickly looked at the 7800XT and it was $499 MSRP vs $559 Red Devil(via PC Part Picker price history).

These days MSRP seems to mean jack shit. I’m just being hopeful.

 

[GreatnessRD]

So is this back to monolith design? Really didn't follow the rumours too much on this

Yes, RDNA4 is monolithic. I suspect they'll return to the chiplets with UDNA design. Or do the hybrid thing again with RDNA3 where the lower tiered GPUs were mono as well.

 

[SolidQ]

650? Matches og GRE price - 650$

 

[Bojji]

650? Matches og GRE price - 650$

Could be 699$ as well.

 

[SolidQ]

Could be 699$ as well.

GRE OG price is 650$, global is 550$. Both card they compare with GRE. That mean 550 for nonXT/650 for XT
In reality we need to see real MSRP or Fake, based on Reaper/Pulse models.
5070ti is 900+ MSRP

 

[Bojji]

GRE OG price is 650$, global is 550$. Both card they compare with GRE. That mean 550 for nonXT/650 for XT
In reality we need to see real MSRP or Fake, based on Reaper/Pulse models.
5070ti is 900+ MSRP

They compared to GRE because that way both GPUs were better. Against 7900XT 9070 would lose in some games for sure.

This is original AMD chart, now we know that it's not for performance:

 

[Elog]

AMD is one of the biggest clients for TSMC wafers. Not far behind the likes of Nvidia.

Looks even like they are #2 on that list since they report two companies in the AMD group separately. Looks like a total of roughly 13% in 2024.

 

[SolidQ]

now we know that it's not for performance:

That was already known. it's street prices. 7900XT was 650$ mostly.
One moment we still don't know how much OC add perf. We saw already Gigabyte from 3ghz to 3.25, but there Nitro/Red Devil models

 

[BeardSpike]

3.25GHZ 330W

i'd assuming Nitro or Red devil further OC

https://videocardz.com/newz/gigabyte-rx-9070-xt-gaming-oc-reportedly-boost-up-to-3-24-ghz-during-linux-benchmark

Linux benchmark of the same card.

Shows 50°C under full load and 329W power consumption and it hitting 3.24GHz boost clock.

 

[Wolzard]

What about the RX 9060? No rumors?

I was looking at the new Ryzen AI 395 MAX with the 8060S and it has basically the same performance as the 7600, close on the 7600 XT.

 

[SolidQ]

What about the RX 9060? No rumors?

there is one model 12GB, but for now is hard to say, which 9600XT or 9060
There 2 variants.
9600XT 16GB with 7800Xt perf
9600XT 12GB with 7800XT perf

9600 still N48 or N44 with 8gb

 

[SolidQ]

Current price 550\650, but during event can be changed

 

[TheRedRiders]

Current price 550\650, but during event can be changed

Current price is actually 450 or 500 but during event can be changed.

See I can do that too.

 

[SolidQ]

Current price is actually 450 or 500 but during event can be changed.

Nope.

 

[Gen.Grievous]

Current price 550\650, but during event can be changed

Seems most logical. Leaked performance slides comparing it to 7900 GRE which had 549 as MSRP and leaked slides mentioning most gamers shop under 700.

 

[Wolzard]

Seems most logical. Leaked performance slides comparing it to 7900 GRE which had 549 as MSRP and leaked slides mentioning most gamers shop under 700.

The logic would be to cost a maximum of US$500, considering that the 6700 XT cost US$479 and the 7700 XT cost US$449.

You need to remember that this is a "7" type GPU. The 7900 GRE is a "9" type, although it looks more like an "8".

 

[FingerBang]

Seems most logical. Leaked performance slides comparing it to 7900 GRE which had 549 as MSRP and leaked slides mentioning most gamers shop under 700.

I think 650 is fair in the current market for the 9070xt, but the 9070 should probably be 500.

It'd be great to have them both at a cheaper price, but realistically I don't think AMD would be able to keep up with the demand.

 

[CrustyBritches]

The logic would be to cost a maximum of US$500, considering that the 6700 XT cost US$479 and the 7700 XT cost US$449.

You need to remember that this is a "7" type GPU. The 7900 GRE is a "9" type, although it looks more like an "8".

That slide from AMD listed above seems to indicate that the numbering is now aligned to Nvidia's cards(i.e.- 5070 = 9070, 5070 Ti = 9070 XT).

 

[dgrdsv]

The logic would be to cost a maximum of US$500, considering that the 6700 XT cost US$479 and the 7700 XT cost US$449.

You need to remember that this is a "7" type GPU. The 7900 GRE is a "9" type, although it looks more like an "8".

Names don't matter. The chip is just slightly less complex than Navi 31 and is using a more advanced N4 node than Navi 31. Expecting it to cost as Navi 32 is fantasy land.

 

[Thebonehead]

Names don't matter. The chip is just slightly less complex than Navi 31 and is using a more advanced N4 node than Navi 31. Expecting it to cost as Navi 32 is fantasy land.

dgrdsv

 

[SolidQ]

Final Specs

 

[Nickolaidas]

I need to experience it first hand. I always have a more negative experience with FSR than what reviews claim. I’ve had the opposite experience with the Nvidia stuff.

Yeah, FSR 1 & 2 were shit. If FSR4 is good, I am interested.

How much VRAM?

Good question. Needs to be 24GB.

 

[Bojji]

Final Specs

Fury X, Vega 64 and 9070XT - AMD really likes that 64CU sweet spot.

 

[SolidQ]

If FSR4 is good,

it's AI, so will be improved over time. In one moment all upscalers will be same, just difference name, but older Battaglia will find extra pixel for DLSS

 

[Bojji]

it's AI, so will be improved over time. In one moment all upscalers will be same, just difference name, but older Battaglia will find extra pixel for DLSS

So far he was impressed. But it's unwise to expect DLSS4 quality from it or even up to date DLSS3 quality.

I think even if it's almost as good as DLSS3 that's more than enough to convince people.

 

[SolidQ]

I think even if it's almost as good as DLSS3 that's more than enough to convince people.

2 days left, we gonna see what new there.

Fury X, Vega 64 and 9070XT - AMD really likes that 64CU sweet spot.

it's again Vega 56 vs vega 64.
Interesting how far it's OC, it's might be near 5080, but bandwidth limit in some scenarios