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[Gaiff]

Xbox vs PC

• Xbox RTGI is lower than PC's lowest
• Xbox AF is equivalent to PC's medium, but looks worse due to VRS. It can look almost as bad as PC's lowest setting
• Xbox volumetrics are lower than PC's lowest setting
• Xbox shadows are closest to medium
• Xbox reflections are closest to ultra

PC

• Texture Pool size does not affect the quality of textures all the time, but it does allow for a larger amount of textures to be cached, resulting in the highest quality textures always being present instead of the more aggressive streaming of lower settings
• Low can initially load low-quality textures and swap in higher quality ones as you look at the game. Sometimes the high-res ones don't load at all
• Optimized settings not necessary. The game's performance doesn't dramatically change from lowest to highest settings
• The settings that matter most are those that are memory-bound as this game seems to be built around 12GB of VRAM
• The RTX 3080 cannot run the Ultra Texture Pool option at 1440p+DLAA, it runs out of VRAM
• Setting the texture pool size to Supreme when running at 1080p causes a bug that breaks the visual
• Does not recommend to set shadows at anything above medium on 8GB GPUs
• Hair setting needs to be set to low at 1440p on 8GB GPUs, otherwise, the VRAM overflows

Issues

• Default LOD is too low as even on PC, there is obvious shadows and objects pop-in, but there is an option to increase it using the developer console
• Shadows even on ultra are very low-res and have cascading issues
• DRS currently only works with TAA, not DLSS
• No FSR or XeSS
• Checkpoints cause frame time spikes. On some levels, it gets very distracting as they are frequent
• 30fps animations also affect PC
• Frame-time spikes on camera cuts, just like on Xbox

 

[onQ123]

Summary incoming...

Apple boy been slipping lately

 

[adamsapple]

Apple boy been slipping lately

Don't you have a 2018 thread to bump?

Apply boy doesn't do PC stuff

This is Gaiff 's baby.

 

[onQ123]

Don't you have a 2018 thread to bump?

Apply boy doesn't do PC stuff

This is Gaiff 's baby.

I'm pretty sure he posted the Xbox video yesterday or the day before also , besides this video also includes PC vs Xbox.

Now get to work on the summery .

 

[Gaiff]

I'm pretty sure he posted the Xbox video yesterday or the day before also , besides this video also includes PC vs Xbox.

Now get to work on the summery .

I posted it, but Adam did the summary. Usually, I do the summary for PC videos.

 

[Darsxx82]

Well optimized for PC, perhaps some sacrifice for GPUS with less than 12GB.

Regarding the comparison with consoles. It is clear that RTGI at 60fps and 1800p resolution required adjustments. Even more so in the face of Nvidia graphics much better prepared for RT.

On consoles the result is still fantastic, but as I said in the console thread, a quality mode uploading assets on par with PC would have been welcome because clearly there was plenty of room. A quality mode with unlocked framerate for VRR TV users is also missed. Maybe in a next patch it will be a possibility if enough people request it from the Studio.

 

[Senua]

I'm pretty sure he posted the Xbox video yesterday or the day before also , besides this video also includes PC vs Xbox.

Now get to work on the summery .

You're very demanding!

 

[welshrat]

Ok watched some of that video, is it just me or is there virtually no difference between low and high when it comes to global illumination on PC ? I think my 7900GRE will do just fine in this game.

 

[Gaiff]

Well optimized for PC, perhaps some sacrifice for GPUS with less than 12GB.

Regarding the comparison with consoles. It is clear that RTGI at 60fps and 1800p resolution required adjustments. Even more so in the face of Nvidia graphics much better prepared for RT.

On consoles the result is still fantastic, but as I said in the console thread, a quality mode uploading assets on par with PC would have been welcome because clearly there was plenty of room. A quality mode with unlocked framerate for VRR TV users is also missed. Maybe in a next patch it will be a possibility if enough people request it from the Studio.

I'm ambivalent to this one. On the one hand, I'm glad it runs well at high resolutions, but on the other hand, this isn't Doom and a lower resolution would have been fine in my opinion. I imagine this game could have been a looker if the target was 1440p/30fps. Instead, we got 1800p60fps, but the game is quite ugly and has a lot of visual issues on Xbox and on PC. I think the pendulum swung too far in the other direction there. Besides the RTGI, which is low-quality on Xbox, this game looks like it belongs on a PS4 with character models and geometry not looking like they should be in a modern AAA game.

Ok watched some of that video, is it just me or is their virtually no difference between low and high when it comes to global illumination on PC ? I think me 7900GRE will do just fine in this game.

Alex mentions there's very little in terms of differences. As you can see in the video, going from Medium to Supreme barely affects the performance aside from killing low VRAM cards.

 

[Mr Moose]

My 3060 stays winning.

 

[JimboJones]

If nVidia ships another 60 series card with 8GB Jensen needs to be punched in the dick.

 

[OverHeat]

lol at showing resetera…in the video. Fuck em

 

[asdasdasdbb]

If nVidia ships another 60 series card with 8GB Jensen needs to be punched in the dick.

9 GB it is.

 

[Xdrive05]

Aaaaand I knew this was coming, so this is how they got me with the 16GB variant of the 4060ti. Paid something like $50 extra for that, but definitely worth it as I'm on a 1440p display.

 

[JimboJones]

9 GB it is.

That extra gigabyte be gddr3 ram too.

 

[Desprado123]

 

[Magic Carpet]

More RAM!

 

[GloveSlap]

I have 8gb vram, so this pretty much confirms my fears. I'll probably just play on Series X at launch and then replay it on PC when i upgrade my 3070.

 

[SF Kosmo]

Those shadow map issues are the big reason I want to play the path traced mode.

 

[Mister Wolf]

US P

Those shadow map issues are the big reason I want to play the path traced mode.

They've saddled us with console quality shadows and LOD pop in.

 

[Three]

• The settings that matter most are those that are memory-bound as this game seems to be built around 12GB of VRAM
• The RTX 3080 cannot run the Ultra Texture Pool option at 1440p+DLAA, it runs out of VRAM

Hmmm, where have I seen this before I wonder? That 3080 owner sure is going to love this explanation this time.

 

[DanielG165]

Looks like I’ll just play this on Series X, and then do another play through when I upgrade my GPU. Good that the console version is as good as it is, although I’m definitely excited to see how path tracing transforms the experience.

 

[Sooner]

Hopefully, we get one for PS5 Pro.

 

[DenchDeckard]

I want the path tracing patch now. I'm absolutely hooked on this game. Played Vatican for about 8 hours straight today.

The game is soooo good.

 

[SF Kosmo]

US P


They've saddled us with console quality shadows and LOD pop in.

For now but the full RT patch is coming Monday.

 

[Physiognomonics]

Xbox vs PC

• Xbox RTGI is lower than PC's lowest
• Xbox AF is equivalent to PC's medium, but looks worse due to VRS. It can look almost as bad as PC's lowest setting
• Xbox volumetrics are lower than PC's lowest setting
• Xbox shadows are closest to medium
• Xbox reflections are closest to ultra

Finally they are comparing VRS vs no VRS and are admitting it's shit.

 

[SKYF@ll]

I think this is a good optimization for consoles. (1800p/ low setting/ vrs)
The resolution is too low for advanced graphics on consoles.
Using powerful graphics on consoles often results in a lower resolution, which results in a terrible final appearance.
I'm looking forward to a full RT update for high-end PCs.

 

[Tchu-Espresso]

Here’s hoping the RTGI can be improved on Pro

 

[Zathalus]

Finally they are comparing VRS vs no VRS and are admitting it's shit.

Finally? They did that years ago.

 

[Schmendrick]

It'll be interesting to see how far they'll go with the PT mode. The RTGI in that game has been thoroughly gutted even on PC.....

 

[Buggy Loop]

Those system requirements were whack

So glad that we get a ray traced game that is well optimized and has good image quality, when compared other releases recently.. Feels good

I might even have a chance to path tracing with 3080 Ti the way things went with the system requirements

 

[adamsapple]

I think this is a good optimization for consoles. (1800p/ low setting/ vrs)
The resolution is too low for advanced graphics on consoles.
I'm looking forward to a full RT update for high-end PCs.

1800p is too low? wat?

Some are complaining in other threads that they should have lowered it to 1440p for visual effects.

I might even have a chance to path tracing with 3080 Ti the way things went with the system requirements

Unrelated observation, but why the fuck does a 3060 have more VRAM than a 3060Ti and 3070?

That makes absolutely no sense ..

 

[Stuart360]

I have 8gb vram, so this pretty much confirms my fears. I'll probably just play on Series X at launch and then replay it on PC when i upgrade my 3070.

I have a 3070, and as long as you put the memory pool to 'low', you can pretty much have everything else on Ultra, even at 1440p (with DLSS on quality as it looks better than native imo).

And the Series X version has a lot of settings lower than the lowest PC settings. The RTGI makes a big difference on PC compared to XSX

 

[S0ULZB0URNE]

Looks like they did a good job on the Xbox Series X

 

[Topher]

Finally they are comparing VRS vs no VRS and are admitting it's shit.

I had forgotten about VRS. Wasn't that stuff Riky had been bragging about earlier in the gen?

 

[adamsapple]

I had forgotten about VRS. Wasn't that stuff Riky had been bragging about earlier in the gen?

Along with VRR, yes.

Don't get the hate it gets, it's a performance saving feature. Some sacrifice will have to be made, obviously.

But the savings may be worth it for the developers more.

 

[GloveSlap]

I have a 3070, and as long as you put the memory pool to 'low', you can pretty much have everything else on Ultra, even at 1440p (with DLSS on quality as it looks better than native imo).

And the Series X version has a lot of settings lower than the lowest PC settings. The RTGI makes a big difference on PC compared to XSX

I saw that, but the texture pop-in on the low memory pool setting looked pretty jarring. I might have to look at the Series X DF video again to see how the texture fill compares.

It's just so frustrating that a perfectly capable card is so gimped by its VRAM.

 

[Topher]

Along with VRR, yes.

Don't get the hate it gets, it's a performance saving feature. Some sacrifice will have to be made, obviously.

But the savings may be worth it for the developers more.

 

[adamsapple]

 

[SKYF@ll]

1800p is too low? wat?
Some are complaining in other threads that they should have lowered it to 1440p for visual effects.

Sorry, Google Translate couldn't translate exactly what I wanted to say.

1800p is high resolution.
720p/RT/HIgh setting or 1800p/Low setting
I like 1800p/Low setting on XSX.
I think if the resolution is too low it just ruins everything.

 

[intbal]

I had forgotten about VRS. Wasn't that stuff Riky had been bragging about earlier in the gen?

Judging from the available presentations at Microsoft's Game Dev blog, it apparently takes way more work to tweak the implementation than most developers are willing to put into it.
Every game will be different and require its own tuning to make sure the shading rate reduction doesn't impact detail.

Martin Fuller's video does the best job of explaining why it's not just plug-and-play.

 

[Physiognomonics]

Along with VRR, yes.

Don't get the hate it gets, it's a performance saving feature. Some sacrifice will have to be made, obviously.

But the savings may be worth it for the developers more.

That's marketing bullshit. Makes everything looks lower quality than lower quality for 5% higher resolution / performance. It looks 50% worse overall. As soon as it's noticeable, it doesn't work and the textures look blocky (4 times less details, because the tech is half-arsed), shitty. There is a reason it's only used on a few select MS games.

All PC gamers I know turn that shit off as soon as possible as according to them: "it makes textures look like PS1 textures to gain unoticeable performance".

 

[baphomet]

Along with VRR, yes.

Don't get the hate it gets, it's a performance saving feature. Some sacrifice will have to be made, obviously.

But the savings may be worth it for the developers more.

VRS is literally just making everything lower quality/resolution.

It's not a positive thing to have it in games.

 

[kevboard]

yet another game that for absolutely no reason does not let PC users use settings that are present on console...

like why? how does that make any sense? it would literally widen the possible playerbase by allowing even the lowest end RTX and RDNA2/3 GPUs to run the game well.

the super low RTGI setting the Series S uses would be perfect for the Steam Deck for example (once the Proton compatibility issues are fixed of course)

 

[DenchDeckard]

Here’s hoping the RTGI can be improved on Pro

My hope is that with the pros extra horsepower they can have a high base resolution. Maybe native 4k and hopefully improve the rt so maybe rt reflections as well as improved rtgi.

That would be an awesome update for the pro.

 

[Bojji]

1800p is too low? wat?

Some are complaining in other threads that they should have lowered it to 1440p for visual effects.



Unrelated observation, but why the fuck does a 3060 have more VRAM than a 3060Ti and 3070?

That makes absolutely no sense ..

Memory bus, with 192bit only options are 3, 6, 12 etc. GB of vram. 3070 is on 256bit bus so for that 4, 8, 16 etc.

They wanted to make 6GB 3060 but they knew they wouldn't get away with it in 2021, that's why 3060 has 12GB and thanks to that performs better than 4060 in some games.

 

[adamsapple]

As soon as it's noticeable

I think that's the point. Outside of places like DF making direct 1 : 1 comparisons, almost no one would know when it's applied.

Memory bus, with 192bit only options are 3, 6, 12 etc. GB of vram. 3070 is on 256bit bus so for that 4, 8, 16 etc.

They wanted to make 6GB 3060 but they knew they wouldn't get away with it in 2021, that's why 3060 has 12GB and thanks to that performs better than 4060 in some games.

Interesting and yeah, it does look like in some aspects a 3060 was more future proof than even a 3070 or 4060.

 

[The Fartist]

I have a 3070, time to download more VRAM.

 

[Nonehxc]

I think that's the point. Outside of places like DF making direct 1 : 1 comparisons, almost no one would know when it's applied.



Interesting and yeah, it does look like in some aspects a 3060 was more future proof than even a 3070 or 4060.

Yep.

That's why that disguised Titan X Pascal known as the 1080ti still packs a punch today. 12gb on a 352bit bandwidth memory bus is nothing to sneeze at.

 

[DanielG165]

The resolution is too low for advanced graphics on consoles.

It’s 1800p lol, that’s extremely high.

EDIT: I see what you’re saying, my apologies. Yeah, I agree!