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[Haunted]

IIRC it's supposedly between 3-5%, compared to NPD's 60%-ish coverage, so of course it couldn't be as accurate (minus miracles). Nobody is forcing anyone to use ioi's numbers, nobody is paying him for his numbers, so just look at it as a fansite and ignore it if you don't like it.

Read between the lines, fuckers like him are probably part of the reason we get less and less data from NPD. Also, other sites (that don't know better, sadly) are starting to takethat chartz site seriously. Which is not a good thing, as some of these wrong numbers are being used as a basis or supportive argument in articles across the web - leading to misinformation and disaster.

Link

Worldwide, of course.

The US is arguably the PC's weakest market. Still, it's clear that it's a more than viable platform, even in the US.

 

[dialmydrive]

Read between the lines, fuckers like him are probably part of the reason we get less and less data from NPD. Also, other sites (that don't know better, sadly) are starting to takethat chartz site seriously. Which is not a good thing, as some of these wrong numbers are being used as a basis or supportive argument in articles across the web - leading to misinformation and disaster.

Nobody takes him or his site seriously. The latest round of terrible press coverage about how he really compiles his shit all but closed the book on that one. Haven't you seen the copy from ioi, or Brett Walton, that made the rounds a month or two ago that was alleged to have come from ioi directly to NPD execs? I think that idiot blew a gasket or something because in that email ioi called for NPD's marketing manager to be fired as well as the real truth behind how he gets his numbers. It's absolutely hysterical to read. It's on various sites. I'll try to find it and post it for you.

 

[FrankT]

Nobody takes him or his site seriously. The latest round of terrible press coverage about how he really compiles his shit all but closed the book on that one. Haven't you seen the copy from ioi, or Brett Walton, that made the rounds a month or two ago that was alleged to have come from ioi directly to NPD execs? I think that idiot blew a gasket or something because in that email ioi called for NPD's marketing manager to be fired as well as the real truth behind how he gets his numbers. It's absolutely hysterical to read. It's on various sites. I'll try to find it and post it for you.

I saw his site being praised by a Wall Street analyst not that long ago, he actually went on to state that VGC had quality data and was better versus NPD for time advantages. Yea I did see the other counter Gamasutra article a week or so after as well. The site has been quoted by number of major media outlets this year and perhaps the message of faulty numbers hasn't hit home yet it would seem.

 

[onipex]

But just because software sells well on the Wii doesn't mean that your title in particular will sell well. 3rd party core games haven't fared as well over there as they have on the HD platforms.

The bold is true for any console. 3rd party core games have bombed on all consoles and will continue to do so. They have also sold well on all consoles and will continue to do so.

I don't think you can really expect the non advertised core games on the Wii to sell as well as the ad blasted core games on the HD platforms ( a couple have though).Even with that point the 3rd party Wii core games have sold well enough to prove there is a market there for it. Since it may not be as costly to develop for it is less risky to release one on the platform.

Seeing as more are being released I'm guessing this point has already started to hit home.Makes no sense to not put core games on the console unless publishers and developers don't want the new gamers to play them in the future.

 

[jakncoke]

man NPD is such a cock tease, I was hoping we'd get the top 20 every month.

 

[dialmydrive]

I saw his site being praised by a Wall Street analyst not that long ago, he actually went on to state that VGC had quality data and was better versus NPD for time advantages. Yea I did see the other counter Gamasutra article a week or so after as well. The site has been quoted by number of major media outlets this year and perhaps the message of faulty numbers hasn't hit home yet it would seem.

Totally agree with you there but again it's all about experience. Most Wall Street types don't know the industry well enough to know better but they eventually learn the hard way. Wall Streeters are always looking for a cheap (free) alternative so no surprises there. What is scary is that they base their decisions on that kind of shit. But then they find out how wrong it is after they get in some deep water one too many times and have to figure a way out of it. Afterwards they leave that site high and dry. Talk to more than one Wall Street analyst and it becomes clear. Nothing good comes for free. Nothing.

 

[Haunted]

Nobody takes him or his site seriously. The latest round of terrible press coverage about how he really compiles his shit all but closed the book on that one. Haven't you seen the copy from ioi, or Brett Walton, that made the rounds a month or two ago that was alleged to have come from ioi directly to NPD execs? I think that idiot blew a gasket or something because in that email ioi called for NPD's marketing manager to be fired as well as the real truth behind how he gets his numbers. It's absolutely hysterical to read. It's on various sites. I'll try to find it and post it for you.

First I've heard of this incident - this pleases me greatly. Please do and post it if you can find it.

I guess it was inevitable, though. Can't live the lie forever, can't supress the truth, the good guys always win etc. etc.

 

[dialmydrive]

First I've heard of this incident - this pleases me greatly. Please do and post it if you can find it.

I guess it was inevitable, though. Can't live the lie forever, can't supress the truth, the good guys always win etc. etc.

Found it. It was on the O'Reilly story site. NPD said they wouldn't waste breath talking about it but they confirmed they received this from ioi. That's all I could get out of my contact there. This doesn't include the part about firing the marketing manager but it includes the good part. This is why so many like the Wall Streeters are misled. They believe what ioi says on his homepage but in reality it's all a lie. here it is:

"I have said many times how what we are doing at VG Chartz is neither interfering with NPD's business nor doing anything wrong. All of our figures are essentially "guesstimates", made by a team of people who have extensive experience at monitoring sales figures and using indicators such as positions on Amazon charts, public bestsellers lists online and at stores like Walmart, Target, Gamecrazy etc and so on. All of our data is above board and legal - we basically fit data to chart positions and using historical information for reference. The constant slander that we are doing something illegal by your senior marketing manager is totally unacceptable. At a push, I'd agree we are maybe a little complimentary to ourselves saying we collect data from retailers - in reality we use public chart positions / press releases / our own estimates to come up with figures as well as our own store on the site. So we are collecting retailer data in effect but not actual figures and nothing which would breach any of your contracts. We are obviously just good at estimating sales and get most stuff in the correct ballpark - not that difficult to do if you know what you are doing."

 

[szaromir]

Could you provide a link as well?

 

[dialmydrive]

Could you provide a link as well?

http://radar.oreilly.com/2008/06/data-on-the-web-********-vs-np.html

Don't you remember this whole shit fest?

 

[donny2112]

Read between the lines, ----ers like him are probably part of the reason we get less and less data from NPD.

This. VG Chartz's undeserved rise (and subsequent fall) follows very closely to the NPD crackdown timeline. In trying to bring undue attention to himself for sales numbers, he's led to the cutting of nearly all data coming from NPD. He is not some innocent "ignore him if you don't like his site" guy.

He's peed in the pool.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

IIRC it's supposedly between 3-5%, compared to NPD's 60%-ish coverage, so of course it couldn't be as accurate (minus miracles). Nobody is forcing anyone to use ioi's numbers, nobody is paying him for his numbers, so just look at it as a fansite and ignore it if you don't like it.

BS. IOI used to say he never made money off the site, now there are ads all over and deals with Amazon or some site to get people to buy stuff thru links. Even has an ad showing what people are buying. Give him enough credibility and he'll sell it. I wouldn't trust that fucker.

This. VG Chartz's undeserved rise (and subsequent fall) follows very closely to the NPD crackdown timeline. In trying to bring undue attention to himself for sales numbers, he's led to the cutting of nearly all data coming from NPD. He is not some innocent "ignore him if you don't like his site" guy.

He's peed in the pool.

Can we soley blame him when the crackdown came soon after the infamous 'Nov NPD movie trailer'? VGC also happened around that time. I blame GAF and pride for that one. With that trailer, it's was a direct taunt to NPD.

 

[donny2112]

Can we soley blame him when the crackdown came soon after the infamous 'Nov NPD movie trailer'?

The GAF crackdown came then, but the near-total blackout, with threats if any data is leaked, that we're in today got bad sometime later. The trailer certainly didn't help matters, though. :lol

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

:lol :lol :lol :lol

LOLtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=od-QZsOFUEw

Jesus-shove-a-pencil-in-my-penis, Youtube is the fuckin 8th layer of hell.

 

[dialmydrive]

BS. IOI used to say he never made money off the site, now there are ads all over and deals with Amazon or some site to get people to buy stuff thru links. Even has an ad showing what people are buying. Give him enough credibility and he'll sell it. I wouldn't trust that fucker.


Can we soley blame him when the crackdown came soon after the infamous 'Nov NPD movie trailer'? VGC also happened around that time. I blame GAF and pride for that one. With that trailer, it's was a direct taunt to NPD.

:lol
ioi doesn't have a deal with anyone. Any website can have an Amazon store widget if they want one but it's hardly a money maker. He admitted in one of his threads that he makes a couple thousand dollars per month from Amazon and ads. That sounds about right but given his track record, inflated ego and issues with impotency, it's hard to believe and is probably less than that. One could only imagine what the groups like Famitsu and NPD are doing with these nuggets of info. - mana from heaven if you will - that ioi keeps dropping but only time will tell.

 

[andthebeatgoeson]

:lol
ioi doesn't have a deal with anyone. Any website can have an Amazon store widget if they want one but it's hardly a money maker. He admitted in one of his threads that he makes a couple thousand dollars per month from Amazon and ads. That sounds about right but given his track record, inflated ego and issues with impotency, it's hard to believe and is probably less than that. One could only imagine what the groups like Famitsu and NPD are doing with these nuggets of info. - mana from heaven if you will - that ioi keeps dropping but only time will tell.

Alright, then, chump change. But it's still money and he made a point of emphasizing that he didn't make money, when people here questioned him. My point remains. He doesn't have morals as a number 1 priority in his 'company'. He frequently tries to push his crap on mainstream media knowing that the reliability of his data is crap. Given the opportunity to make money off of a exclusive 'scoop', do you trust him? I don't.

 

[dialmydrive]

Alright, then, chump change. But it's still money and he made a point of emphasizing that he didn't make money, when people here questioned him. My point remains. He doesn't have morals as a number 1 priority in his 'company'. He frequently tries to push his crap on mainstream media knowing that the reliability of his data is crap. Given the opportunity to make money off of a exclusive 'scoop', do you trust him? I don't.

Of course not. I doubt anyone really does. He lies. It's what he does. He's a professional hustler; a cyber-pirate. The sad thing is he sees nothing wrong with what he's doing. Probably a result of bad parenting or being kicked in the balls one too many times by his grade school peers, but who can say for sure. Not only does he steal proprietary data, he steals "exclusives" from other outlets and lays claim to them. It's what he does. I mean, the Ars Technica story on the 360 price drop was the actual exclusive, not his b.s. Words like "exclusive," and "integrity" :lol aren't in his playbook but he's a real pro when it comes to words like "malware" "piracy" and "scoundrel". But who am I to complain after the hours of fodder he's provided on how not to run a website?

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

But who am I to complain after the hours of fodder he's provided on how not to run a website?

This is actually something I keep in mind. What wouldn't ******** do?

 

[dabra]

Top 20

1 NCAA FOOTBALL 09 (X360, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
2 WII FIT (WII, NINTENDO)
3 GUITAR HERO: ON TOUR (NDS, ACTIVISION)
4 WII PLAY WITH REMOTE (WII, NINTENDO)
5 NCAA FOOTBALL 09 (PS3, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
6 SOUL CALIBUR IV (X360, NAMCO)
7 MARIO KART (WII, NINTENDO)
8 ROCK BAND (WII, MTV)
9 SOUL CALIBUR IV (PS3, NAMCO)
10 CIVILIZATION: REVOLUTION (X360, TAKE 2)
11 NCAA FOOTBALL 09 (PS2, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
12 BATTLEFIELD: BAD COMPANY (X360, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
13 GUITAR HERO: AEROSMITH (PS2, ACTIVISION)
14 SUPER MARIO BROS (NDS, NINTENDO)
15 FINAL FANTASY IV (NDS, SQUARE ENIX)
16 SUPER SMASH BROS: BRAWL (WII, NINTENDO)
17 MARIO KART (NDS, NINTENDO)
18 UNREAL TOURNAMENT 3 (X360, MIDWAY)
19 GUITAR HERO: AEROSMITH (WII, ACTIVISION)
20 METAL GEAR SOLID 4 (PS3, KONAMI)

 

[Mithos Yggdrasill]

Top 20

1 NCAA FOOTBALL 09 (X360, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
2 WII FIT (WII, NINTENDO)
3 GUITAR HERO: ON TOUR (NDS, ACTIVISION)
4 WII PLAY WITH REMOTE (WII, NINTENDO)
5 NCAA FOOTBALL 09 (PS3, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
6 SOUL CALIBUR IV (X360, NAMCO)
7 MARIO KART (WII, NINTENDO)
8 ROCK BAND (WII, MTV)
9 SOUL CALIBUR IV (PS3, NAMCO)
10 CIVILIZATION: REVOLUTION (X360, TAKE 2)
11 NCAA FOOTBALL 09 (PS2, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
12 BATTLEFIELD: BAD COMPANY (X360, ELECTRONIC ARTS)
13 GUITAR HERO: AEROSMITH (PS2, ACTIVISION)
14 SUPER MARIO BROS (NDS, NINTENDO)
15 FINAL FANTASY IV (NDS, SQUARE ENIX)
16 SUPER SMASH BROS: BRAWL (WII, NINTENDO)
17 MARIO KART (NDS, NINTENDO)
18 UNREAL TOURNAMENT 3 (X360, MIDWAY)
19 GUITAR HERO: AEROSMITH (WII, ACTIVISION)
20 METAL GEAR SOLID 4 (PS3, KONAMI)

These two DS games are always present in the top 20, but never in the top 10. So sneaky. Nice legs for Super Smash Bros. Brawl.

 

[RBH]

18 UNREAL TOURNAMENT 3 (X360, MIDWAY)

Man, this game pretty much bombed on every platform.

20 METAL GEAR SOLID 4 (PS3, KONAMI)

Barely stays in the Top 20 (most likely for the final time).

 

[jvm]

20 METAL GEAR SOLID 4 (PS3, KONAMI)

So we know PS2 and Wii NCAA Football 09 numbers which provide very rough upper-lower bounds: 145,000 - 40,000.

I'd guess toward the lower end. (And that really is a guess. I have no inside info.)

 

[AniHawk]

So we know PS2 and Wii NCAA Football 09 numbers which provide very rough upper-lower bounds: 145,000 - 40,000.

I'd guess toward the lower end. (And that really is a guess. I have no inside info.)

MGS4 definitely hit at least 100k from what I hear.

 

[_Alkaline_]

MGS4 may have sold around 100K, but wow, that sure is a big drop.

Brawl is showing nice legs indeed. Still selling over 100K nearly half a year after its release.

 

[AniHawk]

MGS4 may have sold around 100K, but wow, that sure is a big drop.

Brawl is showing nice legs indeed. Still selling over 100K nearly half a year after its release.

MKDS doing 100k 31 months after its release is incredible.

 

[egocrata]

Nintendo has the magic juice to give their games insane legs. At this rate, we are going to see MK Wii, Brawl, Wii Fit and Wii Play in the top 20 until the end of time. Same for NSMB DS and MK DS. That´s six games that sell consistently, no matter what, until the end of time. Pure cash cows.

 

[_Alkaline_]

MKDS doing 100k 31 months after its release is incredible.

Indeed. That, and New Super Mario Bros. are just complete freaks. Both games are still making the charts in the other two regions as well - hell, I think MKDS managed to make the top 10 in Media Create once or twice recently, if I'm not mistaken. Incredible legs.

We've seen signs of Mario Kart Wii and Wii Fit being able to maintain similar legs, which would be an amazing achievement. I think we'll definitely see both games still high up in the charts by the end of year, even despite the number of major releases during this holiday season.

 

[Private Hoffman]

MGS4 may have sold around 100K, but wow, that sure is a big drop.

Brawl is showing nice legs indeed. Still selling over 100K nearly half a year after its release.

If it did 100k standalone, then it probably did 200k including bundles; pretty good numbers if you ask me. It retained ~20% of its initial sales in June.

 

[Linkup]

Nintendo has the magic juice to give their games insane legs. At this rate, we are going to see MK Wii, Brawl, Wii Fit and Wii Play in the top 20 until the end of time. Same for NSMB DS and MK DS. That´s six games that sell consistently, no matter what, until the end of time. Pure cash cows.

AC CF will likely join up with them.

 

[_Alkaline_]

If it did 100k standalone, then it probably did 200k including bundles; pretty good numbers if you ask me. It retained ~20% of its initial sales in June.

I realise this, but you still have to admit it was a pretty big drop for what is the PS3's most significant release so far this gen and for the whole of 2008.

 

[Private Hoffman]

I realise this, but you still have to admit it was a pretty big drop for what is the PS3's most significant release so far this gen and for the whole of 2008.

It's a hardcore game with a focus largely on single player....what did you expect?

This did about what I expected, perhaps slightly more (I was expecting maybe 150k).

The only games that have legs are those with substantial online portions (CoD4) or casual games.

MGS4 doesn't really fit either criteria.

 

[manueldelalas]

It's a hardcore game with a focus largely on single player....what did you expect?

This did about what I expected, perhaps slightly more (I was expecting maybe 150k).

The only games that have legs are those with substantial online portions (CoD4) or casual games.

MGS4 doesn't really fit either criteria.

Explanation time!!

I love how this happens every time =P.

 

[bigmakstudios]

Final Fantasy IV flopped hard.

 

[BLaZiN PRopHeT]

If it did 100k standalone, then it probably did 200k including bundles; pretty good numbers if you ask me. It retained ~20% of its initial sales in June.

didnt they only have 70k bundles when the game launched?

 

[Loudninja]

didnt they only have 70k bundles when the game launched?

I have no idea where you got that number from.

 

[_Alkaline_]

It's a hardcore game with a focus largely on single player....what did you expect?

This did about what I expected, perhaps slightly more (I was expecting maybe 150k).

The only games that have legs are those with substantial online portions (CoD4) or casual games.

MGS4 doesn't really fit either criteria.

I still expected better though. To drop over 15 placed in the charts in a big drop no matter how you put it, even despite the reasons you've stated.

Different examples I know, but single-player orientated games this gen like Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy sold just as well if not better the following month. As I said, different examples, but it still shows that such games can still have legs.

We also have to note that MGS4 is the biggest release PS3 has had - and will have for a good long while. It was THE game for PS3, and to drop so far in the charts is still at least a slight disappointment no matter how you slice it.

 

[BLaZiN PRopHeT]

I have no idea where you got that number from.

im trying to find where i read it at

 

[Redd]

It's a hardcore game with a focus largely on single player....what did you expect?

This did about what I expected, perhaps slightly more (I was expecting maybe 150k).

The only games that have legs are those with substantial online portions (CoD4) or casual games.

MGS4 doesn't really fit either criteria.

...............But MGS4 has a big online portion. It could have long legs as time goes on. At least I hope so.

 

[jibblypop]

Final Fantasy IV flopped hard.

Maybe people are finally started to grow bored of all the remakes?

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

Different examples I know, but single-player orientated games this gen like Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy sold just as well if not better the following month.

To their advantage, though, the following months were December.

 

[Private Hoffman]

I still expected better though. To drop over 15 placed in the charts in a big drop no matter how you put it, even despite the reasons you've stated.

Different examples I know, but single-player orientated games this gen like Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy sold just as well if not better the following month. As I said, different examples, but it still shows that such games can still have legs.

We also have to note that MGS4 is the biggest release PS3 has had - and will have for a good long while. It was THE game for PS3, and to drop so far in the charts is still at least a slight disappointment no matter how you slice it.

The drop in placement relative to others in a list is irrelevant. It's the % drop that matters.

Nintendo games, especially in light of the Wii's success and the release of games in Holiday months, tends to break this trend; though, Metroid Prime 3's legs appear to have been very short and that is a single player experience.

Let's take for instance God of War II: it sold 833k in March and ended up selling 101k in the following month. Again, a relatively hardcore franchise that focuses largely on single player. These numbers are similar to what MGS4 sold, and give a good indication of the type of "legs" you can expect to see from this type of title.

...............But MGS4 has a big online portion. It could have long legs as time goes on. At least I hope so.

MGS4's online portion isn't setting the world on fire. It's a very basic online service that really doesn't impress western audiences like Halo or CoD. Not to mention it's riddled with issues in the sense that the Konami ID system is terrible. Let's face it; people play MGS4 for the amazing single player experience and not the multiplayer. The opposite trend can almost be seen with CoD4 or Halo at this point.

To say MGS4's online play is big isn't accurate, IMHO. Hardly anyone that gets MGS4 really cares about it.

 

[sphinx]

Maybe people are finally started to grow bored of all the remakes?

I can comment on that.

just 1 year and a half ago I bought, played, 100%'d and devoted countless hours to grind like crazy and battling the fucking pink flans to get an item with 0.000001% chance of being dropped in the GBA's port of FF4.

Am I supposed to go through that AGAIN just because they are using a 3D engine now? yeah lol.

SE overestimates their games sometimes.

I am not getting anywhere near FF4 in the next 3 years, sorry S-E.

 

[_Alkaline_]

To their advantage, though, the following months were December.

Yup. That's why I said they can't be directly compared since TP and Galaxy were holiday titles, but it still proves my point to an extent.

The drop in placement relative to others in a list is irrelevant. It's the % drop that matters.

Nintendo games, especially in light of the Wii's success and the release of games in Holiday months, tends to break this trend; though, Metroid Prime 3's legs appear to have been very short and that is a single player experience.

Let's take for instance God of War II: it sold 833k in March and ended up selling 101k in the following month. Again, a relatively hardcore franchise that focuses largely on single player. These numbers are similar to what MGS4 sold, and give a good indication of the type of "legs" you can expect to see from this type of title.

The thing is I don't really disagree with you as such. MGS4 was never going to have the legs of the likes of Guitar Hero, Mario Kart, etc, which are casual, family-friendly experiences that rely on their multiplayer appeal, something which has almost always translated into consistent monthly sales.

What I'm saying is that the drop off (which was expected) is still significant and for the PS3's defining game, it's a bit disappointing. MGS4 had a good first month and helped bring PS3 sales up a bit - this cannot be disputed - but I do feel its drop-off has rendered its impact a bit underwhelming given how important a game it was.

I'n not saying they're bad or disappointmenton or BOMBA or anything of the sort though.

 

[Kilrogg]

The thing is I don't really disagree with you as such. MGS4 was never going to have the legs of the likes of Guitar Hero, Mario Kart, etc, which are casual, family-friendly experiences that rely on their multiplayer appeal, something which has almost always translated into consistent monthly sales.

I know what you mean, so don't worry, I'm not angry or anything, but if we're going to use the word "casual", we should at least use it in a good context. Are we going to argue Mario Kart is a "casual experience" now? 'Cause I sure don't see the ones who've got 8000+ points online, 3 stars (with the wheel sometimes) and incredible records on some tracks as "casual". It's just a question of accuracy and proper use of the words, really: the appeal of MKWii is very broad (family-friendly, as you said), but I think what you really mean is "for everyone", not "casual". For all its lack of clarity, I think we all agreed that a "casual game" was a game that was designed almost entirely to appeal to new customers, excluding gamers like us. The fact of the matter is, Mario Kart appeals to both. This is why it's so successful.

 

[Stumpokapow]

Final Fantasy IV flopped hard.

Nope. It sold more than FFIV GBA did when it debuted in December 2005 and after Crisis Core and FFIII is the third best-selling Square Enix debut this gen.

 

[Spiegel]

I still expected better though. To drop over 15 placed in the charts in a big drop no matter how you put it, even despite the reasons you've stated.

Different examples I know, but single-player orientated games this gen like Twilight Princess and Mario Galaxy sold just as well if not better the following month. As I said, different examples, but it still shows that such games can still have legs.

We also have to note that MGS4 is the biggest release PS3 has had - and will have for a good long while. It was THE game for PS3, and to drop so far in the charts is still at least a slight disappointment no matter how you slice it.

SSBB had a similar drop (in %)

March
WII SUPER SMASH BROS: BRAWL NINTENDO OF AMERICA Mar-08 2.7M

April
Wii Super Smash Bros. Brawl 326K

And without the bundles we really don't know how much has sold.

Nope. It sold more than FFIV GBA did when it debuted in December 2005 and after Crisis Core and FFIII is the third best-selling Square Enix debut this gen.

How much has sold?

Because if it's aprox. 100k means that gba releases sold like shit.

 

[camineet]

I haven't read this thread but I did a quick check on wikipedia, it says Wii is at 29 million units worldwide. So I'd expect that with the by the end of August or beginning of September Wii shall have reached Nintendo 64's install base of 32-33M

 

[CreatureX3]

The drop in placement relative to others in a list is irrelevant. It's the % drop that matters.

How does MGS4's drop compare to the past MGS games?

 

[Stumpokapow]

How does MGS4's drop compare to the past MGS games?

MGS2 and MGS3 debuted in November and so their "natural" monthly drop would be buffered by the "natural" monthly swell of November->December. So you can either talk about monthly drop and blow your lid when it makes MGS4 look awful from not having that seasonal advantage, or we can talk about lifetime numbers which while still very incomplete are a more accurate comparison.

US Lifetime numbers for the first three titles (no VR missions, no Substance, no Subsistence, no bundles rounded to nearest 100k to respect NPD rule, data is available publicly elsewhere yadda yadda):

MGS1 2.4 million
MGS2 2 million
MGS3 1.1 million
MGS4 0.9 million