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[jarrod]

We have cases of the Xbox even outselling the PS2 now and the GameCube's sales paling in comparison.

GameCube has outsold PS2 before also on occasion.

By the end of the Xbox's run, MS will have a nice big foot in the door to kick start the campaign of their second console.

You mean next year? They'll have what, 20 million Xboxes out there?

Nintendo's last console will be remembered with ill thoughts as the console that came in last in this current gen. That's the scope of it.

Last by a million or two units. And depending on how Microsoft handles Xbox post Xenon, GameCube might actually end up 2nd overall....

 

[explodet]

By the end of the Xbox's run, MS will have a nice big foot in the door to kick start the campaign of their second console.

Still, a higher marketshare for one console doesn't necessarily mean improvements for the next. I mean, look at the Gamecube. Much lower than the N64's.

Now I'm not saying Microsoft won't gain marketshare next generation. With the resources Microsoft has, it's pretty likely. It's just not a guarantee that the Xbox marketshare will instantly mean the same or higher marketshare for the Xenon.

 

[DCharlie]

"But isn't that the point - that the potential for the Xbox shouldn't be cut short by the Xenon launching next year?
Or are we on another point right now? I'm trying to keep up, but it's tough. "

what's the alternative though? Stick with the Xbox and wait for everyone to jump ship once the PS3 comes out?

I think MS have got it right this time, if they are confident their machine is going to look indistinguishable or better than the PS3, then they should get in first. They just have to make sure they have the right games line up and that the secondary games are equally as lucious (obviously Sony have to do the same).

 

[explodet]

They just have to make sure they have the right games line up and that the secondary games are equally as lucious (obviously Sony have to do the same).

Yup. When it comes down to it, it's all about the games.

 

[krypt0nian]

...they'd either price themselves out of the market or take huge losses?

What is PSP, Alex?

 

[jarrod]

Shoryken: I believe the final sales of the N64 were just over 40 million.

Both wrong, N64 ended up around 35 milion.

NES/FC~ 80M
SNES/SFC~ 55M
N64~ 35M
GC~ 15M (and going)

GB/GBC~ 120M combined
GBA~ 55M (and going)

VB~ 2M


PS~ 100M
PS2~ 70M (and going)

Xbox~ 15M (and going)

 

[Warm Machine]

I'm beginning to think that the generation after next there should only be platform. The industry needs to be stable and have tech that is supported for more than 4 years.

Companies making 3 or 4 ports of what will essentially be the same game makes no sense. They could be using that dev money on a whole other title. Less SKU's, more oppurtunity to take a financial chance and hopefully more game variety will result.

I doubt that even in this next gen quickly approaching that there will be significant difference between the power of the systems.

 

[Shoryuken]

Both wrong, N64 ended up around 35 milion.

NES/FC~ 80M
SNES/SFC~ 55M
N64~ 35M
GC~ 15M (and going)

GB/GBC~ 120M combined
GBA~ 55M (and going)

VB~ 2M


PS~ 100M
PS2~ 70M (and going)

Xbox~ 15M (and going)

This is only based off of a headline from Nintendo's site, but they claim that they've have sold over 32 million systems. Considering company's never lowball sales I'm guessing it's less than 33 million and closer to 32 million.


Nintendo.com

 

[Brofist]

Both wrong, N64 ended up around 35 milion.

NES/FC~ 80M
SNES/SFC~ 55M
N64~ 35M
GC~ 15M (and going)

GB/GBC~ 120M combined
GBA~ 55M (and going)

VB~ 2M


PS~ 100M
PS2~ 70M (and going)

Xbox~ 15M (and going)

Damn...VB actually sold 2 million. Did the 4 diehard Nintendo fanboys on these boards buy a 1/2 million each

 

[Alcibiades]

Both wrong, N64 ended up around 35 milion.

NES/FC~ 80M
SNES/SFC~ 55M
N64~ 35M
GC~ 15M (and going)

GB/GBC~ 120M combined
GBA~ 55M (and going)

VB~ 2M


PS~ 100M
PS2~ 70M (and going)

Xbox~ 15M (and going)

damn, the GBA is absolutely schooling the XBox...

BTW, as someone that worked in retail, I can tell you that handhelds and games on them are direct competition against home consoles for consumer gaming dollars.

I know plenty of times when parents, casuals, gamers were trying to decide between games (for example) like Mario vs. Donkey Kong or Luigi's Mansion. Pac-Man Collection on GBA or Namco Museum on XBox. Sims on GBA or Sims on XBox. Parents could right now buy 2 GBA (one for each child let's say) or and Xbox or PS2. The portability factor is huge in many decisions for a lot of casuals, and sometimes they go with the GBA and pick up a Zelda or Castlevania.

It's not just GBA vs. GCN though, GBA software is surprisingly attractive even to people owning XBox's and PS2's, sometimes with the older crowd that's heard about or played Nintendo's games like Advance Wars or Golden Sun.

 

[Che]

Let's just take a quick look at these significant marketshare gains, shall we? For shits and giggles...

U.S.:
Sony: 60%
Microsoft: 21%
Nintendo: 19%

Europe:
Sony: 83%
Microsoft: 9%
Nintendo: 8%

Japan:
Sony: 80%
Nintendo: 18%
Microsoft: 2%

Worldwide:
Sony: 70%
Microsoft: 15%
Nintendo: 15%

...arguing who's the 'bigger loser' is null and void at this point.

Obviously Nintendo and Microsoft are the losers. And Alphasnake when they're speaking of money lost-marketshare they're not talking about what Microsoft did. We're talking about BILLIONS lost here man, get serious. Pfft and you admire MS for this? Well, even a ten year old could make any console a success if it spent that amount of money especially in the US where hype and advertising is the main reason of someone to buy anything.

Plus it's not that great outside the US. Europe is buying xbox because of the rampant piracy on xbox so MS instead of making money they're losing more, and the only reason that xbox is outselling GC is that Nintendo is so fucking stupid and they're treating us like shit. For god's sake I can't find the damn Animal Crossing nowhere! After 2-3 years it's FINALLY released here and the idiots didn't have enough pieces to bring to my country! And we all know what will happen in Japan. So I wouldn't bet on Xbox if I were you.

PS. I freaking hate you NOE

 

[Insertia]

What is PSP, Alex?

:lol :lol

 

[DrGAKMAN]

The videogaming industry only chances when a company makes an enormous mistake with a console. And while yes, Nintendo always does make money, you should know that a vast majority of it comes from their handheld division. And this isn't about handhelds. This is about console marketshare. And hell...come December and then March we're going to see if Nintendo can even hold the handheld market in their hands.

Wow, so that magic business formula they taught you at school told you that? Then what happened when Genisis released...what business mistake did Nintendo make that led to Genisis (as most Sega die hards proclaim) almost beating them early on? There is NO magical formula or secret patern to the video game business...it's still relativly too young to try and predict and veiw that way. Anything can happen in this business. I do agree that Sony made it's way to where they are mainly 'cos of Nintendo's mistakes with N64, but Sony made mistakes with PS2 and yet they're still dominant.

I do agree that reputations preceed companies...but that is only PART of what led to Sega's demise of Saturn & DC...the other part being Saturn cost too much to make and Sega was in debt durring those two generations...oh yeah and bad business decisions. Yeah the demise of both systems were due to lack of consumer trust in them 'cos of their past mistakes, but if I remember DC made it to 10 Million units TWICE as fast as either X-BOX or GAMECUBE.

Let's apply the whole reputation theory to Xenon. X-BOX had a shorter lifespan than the competition due to an early jump to next generation with Xenon. That reputation will preceed them. The X-BOX has a built-in HD and is the most powerful console out now, it also has alot of features that X-BOX fans will expect out of Xenon...features that they probably WON'T get, including industry standerd ones. That will preceed them. The competition will be filling out this generation more fully and completly. That will reflect on Xenon as well. Don't get me wrong, there's alot of people who're satisfied with their X-BOX's and will follow on to Xenon, but factoring in the above problems and I can see that hurting their chances next generation...not helping.

Applying it to Nintendo and yes Nintendo doesn't look very good going towards "Revolution". Alot of people were dissappointed with GAMECUBE and/or only had it as a secondary ssytem. However, compared to N64, Nintendo made alot of progress with the companies they burned bridges with in the past and that will precceed them. They'll also be finnishing up the GAMECUBE's life-cycle unlike the N64. This will preceed them. They've sorta got the market expecting them to forever be a kid company, a games only company, but they are turning this around and I don't see the "Revolution" being seen as silly as the GAMECUBE was. The new Zelda is what people want...they're listenning and this WILL preceed them. The Nintendo DS (I think) is going to be a big hit and will introduce new ways to play games and I think people will want more of that. This will preceed them going into "Revolution" and will leave people more open to new ways to play games which will be "Revolution"s hook...'cos it won't be a-typical like the competition. Yeah, Nintendo sorta has a "bad reputation" with alot of people, but there's no game company with as much nostalgic pull...they've been around for so long that there's a big chance for them to start anew since gaming is getting older. If Nintendo just look/be serious then the rest of the industry will take them as such, once they do that then things can/will turn around, and it's due to happen.

 

[explodet]

Damn...VB actually sold 2 million.

Think of all the eyeballs sacrificed needlessly.

 

[Miburou]

Actually, isn't the SNES at 49M and the NES at 69M? Those were the figures given in Nintendo's annual report a couple of years ago.

 

[Datawhore]

I really don't care what happens in this industry, just that I get to continue to play awesome games.

IAWTP!!! Spoken by a true platform agnostic gamer! I heard there were a few of you guys around...

 

[Datawhore]

What's going to happen to the people who buy an XBox this year for Halo 2? They're going to feel burned when Xenon comes out with no BC, and only one year after buying their console.

Most of them won't feel burned because people buying Xbox's this Xmas or in 2005 for that matter are casual gaming late adopters and laggards - most of them won't have even heard of the Xenon.

Will Grandpa be upset about buying a DVD player in 2006, even though Blu Ray and HD-DVD have just arrived? Not likely. The difference though is whether or not MS continues to support Xbox for the casual gamers. DVDs will be made for years to come... Either way, most casual gamers buy very few games anyways. They purchase a few at launch, and then a couple/year and usually purchase Greatest Hits titles instead of full price games. They aren't that concerned about future platform support because they know there are already 400 games available.

 

[AlphaSnake]

Wow, so that magic business formula they taught you at school told you that? Then what happened when Genisis released...what business mistake did Nintendo make that led to Genisis (as most Sega die hards proclaim) almost beating them early on?

SNES came out 2 years after the Genesis, didn't it? Sega had a huge start. It didn't take long for the SNES to catch up and both were neck and neck until Sega lost their mind.

 

[jett]

Oh wait, but you're Kobun Heat. You're Chris Kohler. You wrote a crappy book which somehow makes you think you're special. You will buy and praise everything Nintendo until you die, so why do I bother with you? What I say to you goes in one ear and out the other and you'll somehow twist this into something positive to Nintendo and Anti-Xbox. Oh well.

This could easily be turned into...

Oh wait, but you're DopeyFish. Known GAF assbackwards moron. You're an admin in a shitty xbox site which somehow makes you think you're special. You will buy and praise everything Microsoft until you die, so why do I bother with you? What I say to you goes in one ear and out the other and you'll somehow twist this into something positive to Microsoft and Anti-Nintendo/Sony. Oh well.

Not that I'm into defending the likes of Kobun Heat, but that coming from Mr. THEREISNOSECONDPARTYDURDURIWASDROPPEDONTHEHEADWHENIWASLITTLE was priceless.

 

[DopeyFish]

Huge fucking rolleyes for you.

 

[ourumov]

"Could there be interactivity with GameCube?" he said. "Potentially. Depends on the software and accessories needed from a GameCube perspective. But it's certainly possible. Could there be interaction with the Revolution? Certainly possible. Certainly capable."

That's shit...they can implement connectivity on both machines without problems...Another thing is if anyone would ever give a shit for it.

 

[FightyF]

Reggie sounds scurred!

If he said something like "yeah, MS can do what they want, they'll fall flat on their face" I'd be like this guy is onto something.

But he's like "No! They can't do this to us! Early launch! I mean, they are screwing us all over! They don't want to make money, they just want to screw us over!"

I gotta admit, that was a pretty good Reggie impression on my part!

 

[Kobun Heat]

You know, I think with all of this sidetracking we forgot about the funniest parts about this thread, which are the ellipses in the title that totally change the meaning of the quote. Let's have some more fun with dot dot dot, shall we? Here's mine again just to start us off.

Nintendo of America...has confirmed that...Sony...will bring Revolution to the marketplace...at the same time as...the company is...sold...to... Microsoft ... Speaking at the...Game Summit in London...Fils-Aime also confirmed that the forthcoming Nintendo DS handheld...will almost certainly boast...software.

Let it never be said that I won't make fun of Nintendo.

 

[jett]

Huge fucking rolleyes for you.

What, are you going to pull a marconelly and claim you're an unbiased systems warrior now?

 

[DopeyFish]

What, are you going to pull a marconelly and claim you're an unbiased systems warrior now?

Just because I talk about Xbox a lot, and only have an Xbox right now and only buy Xbox games at the moment... does not mean I'm an Xbox-whore.

Oh wait, but I guess you forgot about the threads I made when I just *had* to borrow a PS2 for MGS2 and GT3 or when I just *had* to borrow a GameCube for Super Monkey Ball. Xbox just has more games suited to my taste than all the others, is all.

And no, 2nd parties do not exist.

 

[Joe]

no guts no glory.

 

[Hitler Stole My Potato]

I'm not one to defend Dopey but he was absolutely right about Kobun Heat. I mean Jesus Christ, the man's nothing more than a mouth piece for Nintendo. He's Tommy Tallarico in a different suit.

 

[Shompola]

hmm yah it would make more sense of first party = the one providing the hardware, second party the one who provides software and third party the one who actually uses hardware+software.

 

[Project Midway]

You would think Ninbots would have already accepted the fact that Nintendo will never again regain their position as number one console manufacturer. Or even number two in western markets.

Its a fact. Accept it. Just enjoy your Nintendo exclusives while it lasts.

 

[MadOdorMachine]

Man this thread turned into a flame war quicker than Tennessee trash in a Vegas whorehouse. Now for my opinion on next gen:
Revolution may be too revolutionary for it's own good. Nintendo has been putting out a lot of quirky games this gen that do not appeal to the mainstream. All of their main titles (Mario, Zelda and Metroid) have suffered from this. I agree that new ideas are important, and I commend Nintendo for seeking them, but look what it's done to those games. All three of them don't even come close to the quality of their predecessors. They lost their mainstream appeal and going into next gen will be a lot harder for them than this gen, and that's coming from a die-hard Nintendo fan. GC was supposed to turn things around for Nintendo and correct the problems of N64. A lot of people stuck with Nintendo because it was still a brand they could trust, but they didn't deliver and now with DS and Revolution all people see are more quirky games. It's going to be very difficult for them to turn things around next gen.
Xbox has been gaining a lot of support in the US and is slowly but surely winning people over. It has the best graphics and almost all of it's games are of high quality. A lot of people (myself included) are just now getting into Xbox. However, it hasn't even been out 3 years yet in the US and Microsoft wants to replace it. What's up with that? It also sounds more and more like PS3 will be the superior console technically, so unless Sony really screws up, I don't see either Microsoft or Nintendo being number one.

 

[Date of Lies]

Revolution may be too revolutionary for it's own good. Nintendo .

You are not ready for the Revolution.

 

[BeOnEdge]

people keep speaking of x2 being the weaker system. wtf difference will it make if the systems will look closer in power than they already do now? its gonna happen. u watch. i say the only difference will be in lighting and shadow effects. TVs are maxed out. whoever has the best HD output and keeps steady framerates at that output wins.

 

[MadOdorMachine]

You are not ready for the revolution.

If DS is any indication, I guess not. I'm definately not buying any systems (handhelds and consoles) next gen at launch. There's too much uncertainty to invest in something that might not last.

 

[ZombieSupaStar]

 

[BeOnEdge]

he looks like he's from panama.

 

[Pug]

Fact is Nintendo is being hit from all sides. Off course Nintendo's market share is being hit big time on the console front by both Sony and now significantly MS. Their bread and butter market the Handhelds, is obviously going to be under threat from PSP. Its a shame really because lets be honest all us gamers in our 30's grew up with Nintendo and Sega. Problem for me is Nintendo didn't grow up with me. I would love Nintendo to be top of the pile but it isn't going to happen especially as in my view, Japan loses more and more significant development to Europe and the US. You can't blame Nintendo for mouthing off problem is less and less developers are listerning.

 

[einhard]

Just because I talk about Xbox a lot, and only have an Xbox right now and only buy Xbox games at the moment... does not mean I'm an Xbox-whore.

LOL

 

[adam20]

reggie is just typical nintendo... thier system will come out late and the games will too. of course they dont want the competition to have too much of a head start. the xbox2 bashing from reggie is just disgusting.

this is also coming from one of the least innovative gaming companies. never one to create top of the line technology... instead we get systems like the DX or whatever the new handheld is going to be called that has graphics which resemble sega saturn's.

nintendo is in no position to be criticizing microsoft. microsoft should be taking shots instead =)

 

[Teddman]

Fact is Nintendo is being hit from all sides. Off course Nintendo's market share is being hit big time on the console front by both Sony and now significantly MS. Their bread and butter market the Handhelds, is obviously going to be under threat from PSP. Its a shame really because lets be honest all us gamers in our 30's grew up with Nintendo and Sega. Problem for me is Nintendo didn't grow up with me. I would love Nintendo to be top of the pile but it isn't going to happen especially as in my view, Japan loses more and more significant development to Europe and the US. You can't blame Nintendo for mouthing off problem is less and less developers are listerning.

Great post & summary of Nintendo's dire situation right now. They really do have their backs against the wall; the next year or two will be very interesting to watch.

If you were to tell me at the beginning of this generation that GameCube would come in behind Xbox when it was all over, I would not have believed it. I railed against posters who did just that back in the day... But MS has surprised me since then and this looks to be the case.

True, future success hinges on how long they're willing to hang in there and take losses up front, but somehow I get the feeling they are going to pull it out and turn Xbox profitable. MS is the BORG. Also, the 'box has the dual purpose of protecting Windows as a PC game platform (XNA, easy ports, etc.) which makes it valuable in other ways. They might not top Sony, but we could see a neck-and-neck SNES/Genesis type situation soon, especially if this trend of Western developers having more worldwide appeal than Eastern devs continues. If Xbox only truly has a good foothold to build upon right now in one region (North America), at least it's also the biggest market.

As for Nintendo, I could see them becoming more like a Macintosh of the video console world, as cliched as that may be. Small but profitable, never to dominate the industry again (consoles), but will always stay alive and be supported by a loyal fan base.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Fact is Nintendo is being hit from all sides. Off course Nintendo's market share is being hit big time on the console front by both Sony and now significantly MS. Their bread and butter market the Handhelds, is obviously going to be under threat from PSP. Its a shame really because lets be honest all us gamers in our 30's grew up with Nintendo and Sega. Problem for me is Nintendo didn't grow up with me. I would love Nintendo to be top of the pile but it isn't going to happen especially as in my view, Japan loses more and more significant development to Europe and the US. You can't blame Nintendo for mouthing off problem is less and less developers are listerning.

Nintendo should do a highly-modified form of the solution that Disney went with when they faced increasing signs of irrelevance in their industry:

One, being, don't fucking wear out your properties (all the time) just because you can. Absence makes the fucking heart grow fonder, damn it. They've diversified their title selection over the years, but they all seem to feature the same main properties....

Create new labels to publish more 'grown up' and varied types of games to appeal to the majority of gamers who are much older than Nintendo's traditional fanbase.

Risk some of that moolah to capture more of the market...hoarding it does nothing...no risk, no reward. (MAKE MORE STRATEGIC PURCHASES and ACTUALLY MARKET YOUR SHIT!)

Keep up with the Jones' while putting your own unique spin and polish on it (ONLINE).

Give your subsidiaries more control over their respective areas (FREE NOA!)

 

[Leviathan]

Let's just take a quick look at these significant marketshare gains, shall we? For shits and giggles...

U.S.:
Sony: 60%
Microsoft: 21%
Nintendo: 19%

Europe:
Sony: 83%
Microsoft: 9%
Nintendo: 8%

Japan:
Sony: 80%
Nintendo: 18%
Microsoft: 2%

Worldwide:
Sony: 70%
Microsoft: 15%
Nintendo: 15%

...arguing who's the 'bigger loser' is null and void at this point.

Actually, the only loser here is Microsoft. The Xbox was forecasted to sell 100 million units, but they fell very short of that target. Not ony that, but they are incapable of making money on the console. The hype surrounding the Xbox is at a fever pitch, yet they can barely sell more consoles on a worldwide basis than Nintendo. The hype surrounding the Xbox inevitably will die down (and I predict that this is going to happen after Halo 2 disappoints many Xbox owners), and when that happens the sales of the console will drop like a ton of bricks. If the Xbox 2 launches early and has less features built into it (like a hard drive) then the console will likely crash and burn like the Dreamcast.

Nintendo's only concern is marketshare loss (with respect to home consoles). Their games continue to sell in the millions, and their profits are massive. Soon they will have, not two, but three profit generating consoles on the market, and with billions of dollars in the bank, strong IPs and increasing profits, they will be going into the next generation in a very strong and healthy financial position.

 

[ourumov]

Just because I talk about Xbox a lot, and only have an Xbox right now and only buy Xbox games at the moment... does not mean I'm an Xbox-whore.

Tell us what does it mean, please.

 

[SolidSnakex]

"Actually, the only loser here is Microsoft. The Xbox was forecasted to sell 100 million units, but they fell very short of that target."

Nintendo's in it too as they were expecting the GC to reach 50 million by March 2005.

 

[ourumov]

"Actually, the only loser here is Microsoft. The Xbox was forecasted to sell 100 million units, but they fell very short of that target."

Nintendo's in it too as they were expecting the GC to reach 50 million by March 2005.

March hasn't arrived yet...They could sell 35M in the following 4-5 months...

 

[Leviathan]

Nintendo's in it too as they were expecting the GC to reach 50 million by March 2005.

They too are off target, but they still have a money making console, unlike Microsoft.

 

[Subitai]

Guys MS is sledding up hill no matter what it does.

Just in the US alone PS2 has more 2+ million sellers than XBX and GCN have 1+ mil sellers combined.

It's only a mistake if people aren't buying it and Sony gets a huge difference in performance. If the hardware is close, MS will be in a better position to get Xenon a more compeitive library. That's the main reason PS2 does so well. Go to any retailer of games, and the PS2 section is at least 50% bigger if not 100-200% bigger.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Actually, the only loser here is Microsoft. The Xbox was forecasted to sell 100 million units, but they fell very short of that target.

Yes, but MS gained marketshare in a tightly controlled maket where they had none. Considering that it mostly comes from one competitor, Nintendo, they have at least scored a (temporary) victory against one of their two 'foes.'

Not ony that, but they are incapable of making money on the console. The hype surrounding the Xbox is at a fever pitch, yet they can barely sell more consoles on a worldwide basis than Nintendo.

See above reply and that they've achieved and maintained a growing pace of sales against Nintendo's GC should give Nintendo a lot to fear when it comes to their continued console market presence and near-100% profitability in the future.

The hype surrounding the Xbox inevitably will die down (and I predict that this is going to happen after Halo 2 disappoints many Xbox owners), and when that happens the sales of the console will drop like a ton of bricks.

I don't think one title disappointing many is going to be soley resposible for the downturn in sales of the platform it sell on. There are other popular games on the system, you know.

If the Xbox 2 launches early and has less features built into it (like a hard drive) then the console will likely crash and burn like the Dreamcast.

Wild speculation, IMO. The games are what matter, right?

Nintendo's only concern is marketshare loss (with respect to home consoles). Their games continue to sell in the millions, and their profits are massive. Soon they will have, not two, but three profit generating consoles on the market, and with billions of dollars in the bank, strong IPs and increasing profits, they will be going into the next generation in a very strong and healthy financial position.

That's a very positive spin on, what seems to me, a darker and more uncertain situation currently.

 

[ourumov]

Marketshare vs Profit

If I had to choose I would choose the first one. Specially if my two rivals are VERY STRONG companies. At this point of the actual generation is all about convincing as many people as you can that you provide the best games, offer the best support and will be the best the next generation. Here is where MS is trying to enter and I think they have done a good job.
Even if Nintendo ends this gen with zero losses, it won't matter tomorrow when Revolution is battling with PS3/Xenon since nobody will have faith on it.
Sure the can't turn things now but they can end this generation convincing at least 15M users that Nintendo has provided a good system. How ? Simple, by not abandoning the system liked they did with N64.

 

[AniHawk]

Wild speculation, IMO. The games are what matter, right?

Wrong. You can have some fucking great games, and a buncha marketing, and it's possible for a system to fail (why, hello Dreamcast). Granted, Sega and Microsoft are in COMPLETELY separate areas of the universe as far as how much money can be spent. MS spent $500 million on Xbox advertising this gen (or was that just launch?). They could probably get away with a fifth of that for Xenon and do pretty damn well.

And I can't believe some of you are using that 100 million number as a goal set by Microsoft. It was never official. My grandpa used to recite the saying, "the first 100 years are always the hardest." I don't think he meant he was going to live 100 years, but used it in a joking manner. That's exactly what I see here with MS. Nintendo made the 50 million goal something set within the company. It was an official mark.

If I had to pick a bigger failure, I'd sure as hell choose Nintendo for this gen. They've shown nothing but weakness after weakness without any intent of fighting back. They let store shelves be overtaken by PS2, PSX, and Xbox games. They let third parties go when they really needed their games- as good or crappy as they may be- to make the GC look as good of a system as the Xbox in the States. They've done a lot to rebuild bridges in Japan, and that's good. Now they need to do the same in the West, since this trend will probably last a good bit into the next gen at the very least.

As far as a Nintendo comeback goes, I think they're gonna have to pull out something really special with Revolution if they want to be taken seriously. They also need to not drop the GC as it goes into its final two years like how Sega did with the Saturn leading into the Dreamcast. Next gen will be the most difficult for Nintendo out of all three companies since they will have to change the negative feeling associated with "Nintendo." I don't think they're up to it, personally.

Bah. I'm tired, and I bet I'll regret this in the morning.

 

[JoDark]

Man, GAF never fails to entertain!!

Anyway. Personally I agree with the statement that WE are winning this gen. There are so many great games for the multi-console owner it's SICK.

As for the topic of conversation, I buy consoles on day 1. I am happiest as of today with my Xbox. The PS2 sits there lonely waiting for exclusives (GTA is the next one I need), and the GC sits there waiting for great 1st party games. It has been awhile since I cared about a 3rd party GC game. I want RE4 and... uh.. OK VJ 2 when it's cheap.

As I buy day 1, I am ready for better graphics. Have you people seen Doom 3??? HL2? Based on history, next gen will look better, and based on what has been said, next gen should be real HD. So I get to play Perfect Dark, and it will look better than HL2. Uh, Ok, here's my money.

How the fuck is it bad that we get to play full on HD games next year. HOW IS THIS BAD. Good god, you would think that you people are arguing life and fucking death.

These are toys, and I am ALWAYS ready for better toys.

As for the DS. From what I have seen, I am waiting for the PSP... OK, fuck that, I need the DS on day one; but what will I play? Puppy sim? SM64x4 when I may know a few people with a DS????? Put the bitch online Nintendo, get your head out of your ass. Give me Mario Kart 64 online on the DS, and you will SMASH the PSP. Give me puppies, and RR that looks like a PS1 game, and the PSP will likely get all of my HH software money.