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GDC's annual State of the Game Industry survey reveals 1/3 of 'triple-A developers' are working on live service games
- Thread starter adamsapple
- Start date
James Sawyer Ford
Gold Member
Not anywhere in the same galaxy, the just released a GOTY and MP GOTY last year
It’s delusional to think some GaaS games from their c tier studios is somehow indicative of poor output overall
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
It's funny how people keep saying this but has anyone actually dug into the numbers?
There were roughly 8 - 10 successful GAAS releases in 2024. How many GAAS flops did we have last year?
People keep saying it's "lightning in a bottle" but I get the feeling the numbers say otherwise.
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Wulfer
Member
or they won't come out with Helldivers 3 and they'll be thankful Helldivers 2 is a success! Microsoft's in the same boat with Minecraft! Scared to do anything because it might damage the brand!
Also, huh i didn't know Naughtily Dog was considered C Tier? You learn something new every day I guess.
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ChorizoPicozo
Member
wait, men in boxes thinks 1/3 of AAA game devs working on GaaS is a win?
that's awful for his narrative.
that's awful for his narrative.
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
They'll need to learn this lesson a few more times before they either 1) figure it the fuck out or 2) go bankrupt. I suspect that for quite a few, it'll end up being the latter. Shifting your development to prioritize live service games can't be easily undone, and the timeline needed to correct course will be too much for several studios.
I'm just glad that none of my GDC meetings are going to be with those sorts of teams.
I'm just glad that none of my GDC meetings are going to be with those sorts of teams.
EDMIX
Writes a lot, says very little
Most definitely, There's always this constant stream of things being developed but I never really care for the term "live service" because in my opinion they're just describing what we understand with online games anyway and what we're talking about with some team making content Post launch for a long duration of time is something that has occurred before that term even was used to talk about any of this lol but I digress
Gambling I don't know about any of that there's a lot of data literally showing you how much people are gaming online and it is the overwhelmingly vast majority, I don't see any gamble here. At least not any more than any other type of game being created it's not like there's a fucking guarantee making a single player game it's going to be any more of a slam dunk.
I greatly disagree, There's absolutely nothing safe about creating a live service game you're talking about amongst one of the most difficult types of games to create in the industry , With having to release Post launch content or having to balance out specific aspects of the game on top of providing numerous updates to correct networking issues on top of having to provide a fresh new experience not just for whatever the base game is but continuously altering and changing that aspect to keep people playing
Nothing regarding that sounds safe even remotely , I would even fucking argue a single player game sounds more safe because it's a static thing
As in you have a beginning middle and end you don't even need to fucking make any type of Post launch content and you don't need to drastically update some massive core design concept on the yearly basis
So I would relax on this idea of safe because I don't know if that describes these live service games lol
I would argue online games require even more creativity to get people to not just go into the game but to continuously play it afterwards on top of trying to set themselves apart from an extremely competitive market
? What does any of that matter though? They are popular because people wish to play with each in those games, to pretend they are moving those units SOLELY based on being "sports games" is a bit naïve
Of all the gamers, why the fuck would sports fans magically not wish to play against other people in a idea literally about competition? So those new games games not all being sports doesn't really change much of any of this considering the licensees needed in a lot of those markets in the first place
semi-moot lol
I mean people could say what they want, But I think a lot of people on here are scared to see the reality regarding a lot of this I can't even say this is the future of the medium, it literally is the current as of right now the vast majority of gaming by in ridiculous degree is online we literally have Call of Duty online mobile with over 600 plus million people...When I said "It's the future of the medium" I meant "It's the future of the medium."
We could only get to GTAV getting 200 million and clearly this was because it's online portion....
Call of Duty Mobile has ‘topped 650 million downloads’ | VGC
Number of players last year almost matched total amount of console and PC users…
www.videogameschronicle.com
https://venturebeat.com/games/among-us-surpasses-500m-mobile-downloads-since-launch/
People playing together is not a future idea, that is happening right now as the majority and i think hardcore gamers are either clueless about this or having a hard fucking time with reality and please note, I don't play any of those games, I think the only online IP I even play is Battlefield series.
When something like a online game, live service, GAAS or what ever someone wants to fucking call it like Fortnite has over 650 million users and monthly 100 plus million visits, I think its time to put that horseshit idea to bed about this just being some one off, random thing or something.
That is that majority. I don't know how many times someone needs to hear some fucking game doing 300 million downloads to realize single player games are not the majority.
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bitbydeath
Gold Member
Sports is an already catered market.
It is not wise to take your chances on GaaS as the majority (outside of sports) fail hard.
Killjoy-NL
Member
Makes sense. A successful live-service game is lucrative business.
As much as some old school fans might hate it, it's here to stay.
Traditional singleplayer and live-service games can coexist, you know?
As much as some old school fans might hate it, it's here to stay.
Traditional singleplayer and live-service games can coexist, you know?
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RetroGamingUK
Member
Japan will fill the void when all these shitty western publishers have collapsed.
you mean the publisher that's been doing more singleplayer releases than most publishers?
Videogame industry reset coming. Starting with Sony.
Hold the line don't buy!
You guys should start looking inwards, you know, what Rare has been regulated to, what ABK puts its studios on, what Bethesda Game Studios mostly is now, where Square makes most its money while people gloat about its single player failures, what Konami makes its most profits on, that sort of thing.
GDC isn't just western devs. It's a global conference. Asia has gone just as hard into GaaS, Monster hunter, SF6 and every fighting game, efootball, Genshin Impact, FF14, Marvel Rivals, PubG etc. These are what's making money hand over fist for these publishers as unfortunate as that may be.
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I hate it too but believe it or not you have just as much chance of catastrophic failure making a non-gaas game. Might as well chase that high reward.
Wildebeest
Member
Dying trend with too much competition and not enough innovation, but still healthier than AAA cinematic games.
Soodanim
Gold Member
This is what I don't get. Concord didn't even last a fortnight, let alone get Fortnite money. Fortnite's money belongs to Fortnite, but these companies all think they're going to somehow come alone and steal it with an unestablished product.
That's not a race anyone is going to win, especially when the leader has had so many more years head start on you and showing no signs of stopping any time soon.
You can say Overwatch or something else is a better example, but the same still applies. Imitations don't win anything.
samoilaaa
Member
i agree with you , developers follow the money BUT
lets say you have 10 teams , each team develops a live service game , only 2 maybe 3 games out of those 10 will be successful because a person cant play and invest money in 10 games at the same time so they will chose the better one
its a big gamble , its not like single player game where you buy it , finish it , the end , GAAS is a couple of years of investment from the player , if you wont buy the annual expansion whats the point of getting into this kind of genre
its like playing destiny 2 only the base game
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Wandering Leopard
Member
Some of the reactions tell you those who're a little too addicted to AAA.
There's nothing wrong with exploring the indie space.
There's nothing wrong with exploring the indie space.
Hyet
Member
Around 1/3 of videogame investment going into the one of the most high risk categories is really bad news. Not even with all the growth the medium has experienced, the audience doesn't have physical time to be significantly attached to so many GAAS. Most people just play one or two and pay for none. This sounds terrible.
EDMIX
Writes a lot, says very little
fuck are you talking about? Japan out here making online focused titles too lol So Monster Hunter, FF MMOs, Them fucking Gotcha games, Splatoon, Mario Kart, Smash Bros, Animal Crossing etc they just going to not be online to um "fill da void" or?
nowhat
Member
No, they'll get Concord money!
What do you mean? In the survey, 42% of all devs said they don't want to work on a live service game as their next project while only 13% said they do. That's all devs, not just AAA, but still.
However, 33% of AAA devs working on a live service game is a lot indeed. I personally don't mind live service games when they are good, the issue is a lot of it seems forced recently.
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The title is a little misleading. It's 1/6th of devs working on GaaS and another 1/6th saying they'd want to.
1/6 of all devs are working on GaaS (and another 1/6 of all devs would want to), while 1/3 of AAA devs are working on GaaS. So the title is correct as far as I can tell.
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Astray
Member
GAAS is pure slop and I fucking hate it, but the way people talk about how it's on the way out can only be explained by the phenomenon of wishful thinking.
Just this past year we've had outright GAAS hit games like:
- Marvel Rivals
- Helldivers 2
- The First Descendant
Add to this GAAS-like games that primarily want to court and maintain engagement to keep selling expansions like:
- Palworld
- Enshrouded
I'm sure I missed examples here. GAAS is sadly not dead and likely never will be.
Just this past year we've had outright GAAS hit games like:
- Marvel Rivals
- Helldivers 2
- The First Descendant
Add to this GAAS-like games that primarily want to court and maintain engagement to keep selling expansions like:
- Palworld
- Enshrouded
I'm sure I missed examples here. GAAS is sadly not dead and likely never will be.
Hyet
Member
Thanks for pointing it out. 1/6 is not as concerning.
PatientGamer
Member
Best way to respond to this is to simply not buy it en masse. We don't want this shit. Sure, 14-year olds and insufferable YTs and Streamers will buy any garbage; but the vast majority couldn't care less about GaaS content. Marvel Rivals is one of the very, very few exceptions to the rule.
The problem is that AAA studios all think that they are too.
When I heard that Warner Bros was thinking of making Hogwarts Legacy GaaS shite, I was aghast with disgust... this better not be the future of the industry otherwise I'm out and many others are too.
Unless that's what these corporate buffoons wanted all along
The problem is that AAA studios all think that they are too.
When I heard that Warner Bros was thinking of making Hogwarts Legacy GaaS shite, I was aghast with disgust... this better not be the future of the industry otherwise I'm out and many others are too.
Unless that's what these corporate buffoons wanted all along
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Felessan
Member
Numbers straight from the ass
Matured market failure rate is not that much higher compared to SP games
It doesn't work this way anymore. Modern gaas avoid player lockdown
Like Mihoyo has several games that in direct competition and they even align content delivery to reduce friction over players money
WoW phenomen is a good example - industry did non return to SP games after it. Clones failed for most part (except ff14) but those who differentiate themselves expanded gaas market even further than wow did. Moba and to a lesser extent Battle royale are results of post-wow live service gold rush. Moba alone upped live service market by hefty 5+ billions.
Hate is so strong that it blinds people
Same Japan where market penetration for live service game so high that SP focused studios forced to practically abandon local market?
Shaki12345
Member
Gaming industry is about to implode ro hopefully reinvent itself. It's unsustainable.
Felessan
Member
If we look to a global, ZZZ, WuWa, Solo Leveling and GFL2 should also be in the list
Dr. Samuel Hayden
Member
The industry desperately needs another crash
DonkeyPunchJr
World’s Biggest Weeb
Future headline:
“1/3 of Game Developers got Laid Off Last Year”
“1/3 of Game Developers got Laid Off Last Year”
Felessan
Member
It most likely will lead to eradication of all but niche SP games as by the time industry recovers majority of players will be one that grew up on live service games
Yep, the people asking for a crash don't realise that the ones which wouldn't be affected as much are the Fortnites, FiFas, and other prominent GaaS games that they want it to crash for. They'll just wipe out the SP and AA games.
Kenneth Haight
Gold Member
FewRope
Member
This is the actual problem imho, new players just one F2P game all the time, they dont have any kind of curiosity about gaming in general. I believe we are beyond cooked
Angry_Megalodon
Member
We have to differentiate "traditional GaaS", which is MMO, MOBA, multiplayer (mostly without story mode) from the gacha AAA which are basically single-player AAA games that get massive yearly updates as if they were parts of a franchise. In that sense, there's no difference between Wuthering Waves version 2.0 and Spiderman 2.
Quality-wise, these games blow their retail counterparts out of the water and that's only possible because they are funded that way. You can't have JRPGs looking like WuWa or Infinity Nikki if the business model is not GaaS. It's impossible.
However, Western devs are working on multiplayer-focused GaaS a la Fortnite or Overwatch and this is a massive waste of talent and resources because there's space for only a few.
Quality-wise, these games blow their retail counterparts out of the water and that's only possible because they are funded that way. You can't have JRPGs looking like WuWa or Infinity Nikki if the business model is not GaaS. It's impossible.
However, Western devs are working on multiplayer-focused GaaS a la Fortnite or Overwatch and this is a massive waste of talent and resources because there's space for only a few.
Astray
Member
Wishmaster92
Member
I’m so glad this shit is a dying trend. Make innovative single player games again
chromatic9
Member
The sperm race.
Hypereides
Member
Neat. Well, at least there are still smaller devs (indie, A and AA) who still remain focused on doing sharp, reasonably scope SP games.