Support NeoGAF

[Mr Reasonable]

'Toxic male masculinity'.

Quite a few girls in his school are far more toxic than any boy will ever be. They're vile little creatures.

It's all mind rot perpetuated by retarded adults.

How anyone can look at any of this and think we, as humanity, will come out of this with any good outcome is far beyond my realms of thinking.

 

[Dr.Morris79]

Terrible isn't it

At least I'm just an Anomaly and bad things aren't happening eh. We've never had it so good

 

[nush]

She wasn't promiscuous like that, she just held herself to an unrealistic standard.

You won't know this but dating apps allow women to be very discrete. I've "met" a number of women through those apps that will state to me in the chat they have a boyfriend or are married before following that up with "Are you on your own*?"

*At home.

 

[-Minsc-]

Problem is, they spend all their time gawping at idealised versions of women on the internet, instead of mixing with real ones. They get an extremely warped view of what a woman is, and their standards are way too high.

AI image generation, at your service.

I think this is true for women as well. So long as they have a roof over their head and food, a lot of women seem pretty content waiting and waiting for that "perfect guy" to come along, not really realizing that she is competing with THOUSANDS of other women just like her for that one guy. Almost any woman can get a bit of male attention, their problem is KEEPING it.

Men have the opposite problem, really.

I think the decay of the traditional social structure through church and extended family makes it a lot easier for these folks to be completely isolated. If you have 8 siblings, chances are one if them is gonna be socially excluded but at least they have family and usually a church. If you are an only child though and church isn't your thing, no one is really looking out for you if you can't build bridges elsewhere.

LOLBruh, the prevalence and normalization of dating apps are 1000% the primary driver of inceldom. Don't look up the objective metrics on how 90% of guys perform on them. There's no easy fix or cure cause many of their core greivances are actually real, not halucinated conspiracies.

My own personal experience tells me that getting out and interacting with people face to face is best. As I've mentioned before, I met my wife at church. Face to face meetings made things much easier. If I met her through a dating app I doubt we would have gotten together, that method just did not feel natural to me.

As mentioned by others above, simply getting out there and interacting with people in general is probably the best thing a guy can do.

Once a guy has built up some confidence interacting with people he can be that guy who comes out of left field. This jaded lady who is entrenched in online dating suddenly meets this guy when she least expected. The first contact is not over the internet, it's face to face

Be that guy.

 

[TransTrender]

Incel to tranny pipeline

 

[Trunx81]

Where is a link to the actual study? Odd the article writers would randomly insert such a thing

Pretty sure it’s this one

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/epdf/10.1080/00224499.2023.2248096?needAccess=true

 

[JimmyRustler]

Incel is the dumbest term I've heard of in this current era.

Is it really that hard these days to bang a fat or ugly woman?

Milfs aren't that picky, either.

Do you bang everything just because you get pussy? What is this? Animal kingdom?

 

[jason10mm]

You won't know this but dating apps allow women to be very discrete. I've "met" a number of women through those apps that will state to me in the chat they have a boyfriend or are married before following that up with "Are you on your own*?"

*At home.

Yeah, dating apps enable slut behavior for sure, for both genders.

 

[LegendOfKage]

I have to wonder which came first, discovering that incels are more diverse and left-leaning, or deciding that they actually deserve sympathy and better mental health.

 

[LegendOfKage]

What's the difference between an incel and an otaku?

 

[Darkmakaimura]

Huh.

 

[Tams]

On the subject I will always look back on this interview and I will never forgive people who watch this and thought Peterson was worthy of mockery for what he said here.

The Guardian, of all outlets, and a female reporter at that, did one of the fairest takes on Peterson.



Now, since then, Peterson has gone a bit off the rails and had probably issues. But still, he was, and is now returning to, being of help to lost men.

 

[nush]

Yeah, dating apps enable slut behavior for sure, for both genders.

Nothing in my history ever indicated " Being a manslut" was on the roadmap.

 

[Haint]

My own personal experience tells me that getting out and interacting with people face to face is best. As I've mentioned before, I met my wife at church. Face to face meetings made things much easier. If I met her through a dating app I doubt we would have gotten together, that method just did not feel natural to me.

As mentioned by others above, simply getting out there and interacting with people in general is probably the best thing a guy can do.

Once a guy has built up some confidence interacting with people he can be that guy who comes out of left field. This jaded lady who is entrenched in online dating suddenly meets this guy when she least expected. The first contact is not over the internet, it's face to face

Be that guy.

The catch 22 is incels are not interested in being the "ready to settle down" meme for jaded ladies who've been running trains on tinder hookups. As I said, that kind of rhetoric only supports and reinforces their grievances.

 

[Tams]

Sex workers are exactly what they don't need. That will push them even further down the rapidhole because that's exactly what they think about woman, nothing more then sex objects.

Back in the day we had conscription for the army, and this resulted in mixing people with other people and spend time with them. It was great to kill barriers created between rich / poor / racist / not racist / political andy's. Because they all where forced to work together u suddently realized that your buddy in the army u spend 2 years with and is black actually isn't that bad of a guy. Or your right leaning voter u though was a nazi was actually not that bad of a guy.

The same shit should happen for incels, instead with incels let them go into therapy, let the therapist move them into somekind of charity thing they have to attend towards that is dominated by woman, and let them have to work with them, eat with them, share there life with them etc. And sooner rather then later they will realize they are no longer part of that incel club because they are just deranged with the reality.

It also kills there isolation and they can make friends or even relationships out of it.

I found a movie with this concept really good, that was called american history X. this main character absolute hates black people, grows up in a culture where they all hate them, wars them and gets into jail as a result. And guess what happens? his best buddy became a black guy because he's forced to spend time with him. He returns to his nut neightbourhood and realizes how fucked in the head they are.

The issue there is, sometimes the stereotypes are right. That in some ways, what incels (or whatever other group) are worried about is true and real.

There are psychological differences between men and women. All of the women where I work are bossy and demanding to some degree, while all the men are just, chill. I've had to bite my tongue over what some of the women have said several times, as the grief you get from questioning their judgement is just not worth it. The men take it on the chin much better. And yes, I have tried my best to think around it, yet keep on coming back to the same conclusion.

The women aren't bad people, but they are different and I don't know if I'll ever really get fully used to working with them completely openly.

And it's the same with people from different cultures. Yes, some integrate phenomenally, even becoming more native than actual natives. But many don't. I've seen it happen many times; both into my own culture, and those from mine into another.

 

[*Nightwing]

 

[Days like these...]

I was into skateboarding into my early 20's I thought I'd die if I was rejected so I avoided women but then one of my sister's friends jumped my bones and the rest is history. Unfortunately I stuck my dick in crazy and I'm still paying for it

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Kind of looks like the Digital Foundry guy.

 

[Reizo Ryuu]

I was into skateboarding into my early 20's I thought I'd die if I was rejected so I avoided women but then one of my sisters jumped my bones and the rest is history. Unfortunately I stuck my dick in crazy and I'm still paying for it

 

[Zelduh]

I was into skateboarding into my early 20's I thought I'd die if I was rejected so I avoided women but then one of my sisters jumped my bones and the rest is history. Unfortunately I stuck my dick in crazy and I'm still paying for it

You stuck your dick in your crazy sister?

 

[Kilau]

I think it's more that he cries a lot, sometimes over children's media

What's his GAF handle?

 

[nush]

then one of my sisters jumped my bones

 

[Days like these...]

I just realized why everyone was clowning me. Obviously I meant sister's friend

 

[Mistake]

Pretty sure it’s this one

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/epdf/10.1080/00224499.2023.2248096?needAccess=true

No hits. Only thing in the study I saw was "political attractiveness" for a reason to be or not be with someone. Doesn't say alignment anywhere, although the beginning points at misogynistic behavior and andrew tate types. Anyway, good catch

 

[ReBurn]

That's the most ridiculous thing I'll read today. As it is, therapists have to be careful that their clients don't form attachments to them. Imagine if every session ended with "want to drop a $100 and I'll drop my pants?"

$100 seems like a bargain

 

[bitbydeath]

Incel to tranny pipeline

Also why they hate vocal feminists like JK Rowling.

 

[Banjo64]

Someone make me a bumper sticker;

'he's a sexually successful male and I'm not like that'

 

[EviLore]

Sex workers are exactly what they don't need. That will push them even further down the rapidhole because that's exactly what they think about woman, nothing more then sex objects.

Back in the day we had conscription for the army, and this resulted in mixing people with other people and spend time with them. It was great to kill barriers created between rich / poor / racist / not racist / political andy's. Because they all where forced to work together u suddently realized that your buddy in the army u spend 2 years with and is black actually isn't that bad of a guy. Or your right leaning voter u though was a nazi was actually not that bad of a guy.

The same shit should happen for incels, instead with incels let them go into therapy, let the therapist move them into somekind of charity thing they have to attend towards that is dominated by woman, and let them have to work with them, eat with them, share there life with them etc. And sooner rather then later they will realize they are no longer part of that incel club because they are just deranged with the reality.

It also kills there isolation and they can make friends or even relationships out of it.

I found a movie with this concept really good, that was called american history X. this main character absolute hates black people, grows up in a culture where they all hate them, wars them and gets into jail as a result. And guess what happens? his best buddy because a black guy because he's forced to spend time with him. He returns to his nut neightbourhood and realizes how fucked in the head they are.

How much are we paying these unlucky women to cohabitate with deranged angry permavirgins from the purple forum until they’re cured? Can the economy really withstand it?

 

[Sgt.Asher]

How much are we paying these unlucky women to cohabitate with deranged angry permavirgins from the purple forum until they’re cured? Can the economy really withstand it?

 

[SF Kosmo]

So before incels were right wingers, now they are left leaning

That's not what it says. It just says that there is more diversity than previous studies suggested, not that this group leans left overall.

Of course it tilts right, but I don't think leaning right makes you more likely to be incel; It think it's just because the right (in people like Jordan Peterson or Andrew Tate or many others) tries to reach out to these people and offer them answers -- even if they're the wrong ones. The left, on the other hand, tends to shame or blame these people.

It's interesting because it's a clear reversal from how these two groups discuss poverty -- the right blames the poor for their circumstance and tells them to work hard and pick themselves up by the bootstraps, where the left talks about collective and systemic factors that contribute to poverty.

I think the phenomenon speaks to poorer socialization in adolescence and early adulthood. More texting, less actually learning to interact in person and read non-verbal cues. And it becomes self-reinforcing as these guys get more pissed off at the world instead of working on their game.

 

[Mistake]

How much are we paying these unlucky women to cohabitate with deranged angry permavirgins from the purple forum until they’re cured? Can the economy really withstand it?

We just need to redirect their attention with anime waifus and fleshlights

 

[DKehoe]

LOLBruh, the prevalence and normalization of dating apps are 1000% the primary driver of inceldom. Don't look up the objective metrics on how 90% of guys perform on them. There's no easy fix or cure cause many of their core greivances are actually real, not halucinated conspiracies.

I haven’t used Tinder in a little bit now. But when I did I didn’t find it particularly hard to find women to date or hook up with. And people were saying the same kinds of things about it at that point.

Yeh women get a lot more matches than men. That’s the nature of those apps. But as a man you can absolutely still meet women through them.

I don’t think I’m especially great looking or have incredible charm. I’m probably around average in both of those areas. But if you just talk to women normally and build a connection you can go from there. It’s not complicated. It might not always work out every time and you maybe have to put a bit of work into it rather than expecting it to come to you but it’s totally achievable. If some guys take some worldview of being “blackpilled”, have decided that most women are “NPCs” or whatever kinds of other dumb shit they say or think then yeh they’re going to put themselves in a mindset thats going to make it harder. Then if they want to continue to make excuses and play the victim that’s on them.

The other issue is that there are people out there who are actively trying to play on the insecurities of desperate people so they can make money.

 

[Trunx81]

I see a lot of parallels between the Intel and the extrem parts of the 2LGBTQ+ movement. Especially the “I deserve it” part and the hate ..

 

[SF Kosmo]

I haven’t used Tinder in a little bit now. But when I did I didn’t find it particularly hard to find women to date or hook up with. And people were saying the same kinds of things about it at that point.

Tinder and Bumble are very looks-based, because you can't really communicate until someone has swiped you back. As a looks-challenged guy, I found these apps tedious and a lot of work.

But at that same time, I could go on OKC or Hinge or any of the apps that actually let you message without gatekeeping, and I could line up dates for every night of the week; 4-5 women in the rotation at any given time. Learning how to talk a good game is way more useful (and teachable) than simply swiping on enough women until one thinks you pass her looks bar.

 

[Woggleman]

Incels are in a long line of groups who need to pry their eyes away from the screen and live real life.

 

[BigDeadFreak]

I'm not seeing the relevance of political leaning in this situation. Depression has risen over the years in general, losing hope for the future.

We need find a way to bring these kids in, and make them feel involved in the day today. Instead of easily involving themselves into shitty escapists ideologies or 'get successful quick' schemes.

I think part of the relevance is that plenty of people have dismissed them as evil right wingers who are, therefore, not deserving of help and support. There's a lot of bitter, resentful people on the left who are very selective in their empathy.

 

[LordCBH]

So before incels were right wingers, now they are left leaning

And now that they’ve discovered some of them are left leaning NOW they say they need mental help lol. Before it was “lol incel fuck off”

 

[Lunarorbit]

Maybe this thread and the amouranth thread should be combined cause.... woof

 

[SF Kosmo]

And now that they’ve discovered some of them are left leaning NOW they say they need mental help lol. Before it was “lol incel fuck off”

Yeah for some reason the left turn into rugged individualists when it comes to these people.

And look, I get that a lot of them are toxic and frustrating and see themselves as victims (this is one of the big takeaways from the study not emphasized in the article). But do we want to help them or drive them further into despair?

 

[belmarduk]

The most fascinating incels are the transgender ones who try to date lesbians. These incels are almost always unable to pass as women and lesbians generally prefer to date women so this rarely works out.

 

[Wildebeest]

If you are ugly and broke, just learn how to play the guitar, and wear tight trousers. Time tested method.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

The most fascinating incels are the transgender ones who try to date lesbians. These incels are almost always unable to pass as women and lesbians generally prefer to date women so this rarely works out.

Makes sense. The vast majority of gay or lesbians want to date someone born the same as them. Its just that they prefer having sex with their own gender.

It goes for straight people too. If a trans person dolled up ad acted like a women but has a schlong, no thanks. I dont care if you look like Shakira. You got the plumbing of a dude no matter what you think.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Incel to tranny pipeline

Best avy/username/post combo ever?

 

[jason10mm]

I think this is just an attempt to get incels on the victim pyramid. These days is all about how pitiful and victimized you are and how much assistance and pity you deserve, not how resilient, resourceful, and how independent you are.

Folks LOVE to cry "mental health, mental health" as if they have some sort of organic brain disorder, but what they really mean is "poor mental attitude" which could be easily fixed with putting down the phone, getting outside, and seeking healthy challenges.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

I think this is just an attempt to get incels on the victim pyramid. These days is all about how pitiful and victimized you are and how much assistance and pity you deserve, not how resilient, resourceful, and how independent you are.

Folks LOVE to cry "mental health, mental health" as if they have some sort of organic brain disorder, but what they really mean is "poor mental attitude" which could be easily fixed with putting down the phone, getting outside, and seeking healthy challenges.

Yup. Victimhood losers.

The people who cry about being accepted will be the same ones who have their own sexual/gender preferences. It's not like they go all out fucking every person that moves. So the same can be said back to them.... dont discriminate and be open to fucking anyone of any sexuality and gender. Nope.

 

[crazepharmacist]

I always think of Elliot Roger as the original incel. I think that was when I was first introduced to the term.

 

[Days like these...]

The most fascinating incels are the transgender ones who try to date lesbians. These incels are almost always unable to pass as women and lesbians generally prefer to date women so this rarely works out.

This absolute insanity becoming a transwoman to try and get a girlfriend. It would be so much easier to bathe, put on some decent clothes and go outside and talk to girls.

 

[nush]

go outside and talk to girls.

 

[DrFigs]

If you are ugly and broke, just learn how to play the guitar, and wear tight trousers. Time tested method.

this works until you're like 20. and then women stop caring about both.

 

[SF Kosmo]

I think this is just an attempt to get incels on the victim pyramid. These days is all about how pitiful and victimized you are and how much assistance and pity you deserve, not how resilient, resourceful, and how independent you are.

Folks LOVE to cry "mental health, mental health" as if they have some sort of organic brain disorder, but what they really mean is "poor mental attitude" which could be easily fixed with putting down the phone, getting outside, and seeking healthy challenges.

That's a narrow view of mental health, and also ignores the fact that macro-level shifts and trends always have institutional causes.

Like, if unemployment is high, you can give a person advice on how to get a job or brush up their resume and that advice might be good and it might even work for that guy but it isn't really the reason that unemployment is high and won't help the overall problem.

Likewise it's obvious that many incels could be a lot better off with an attitude adjustment and some coaching, if they learned how to talk to women like people, wash of the stink of desperation... But it ignores the issue of why more and more men are falling behind in the first place.