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[SmokedMeat]

Square is lying through their teeth.

They want money upfront for their games, and they’re trying to cultivate an atmosphere where unless you pay them upfront - your system’s not guaranteed a port.

Sony didn’t offer Square money for Octopath so it didn’t appear on PlayStation.
This time they decided to “challenge” themselves by porting their bleeding edge pixel sequel to include PlayStation but not Xbox, because they want Microsoft to offer money for it.

Square knows they can’t play Nintendo and PC like that, so they don’t bother trying.

 

[Corndog]

Fucking hell man I clearly told you that it is not that it was never delayed just not into 2023 how hard is it to understand?Do you not speak english? look at the link I provided, I explained it to you multiple times and as clearly as possible...No wonder you don't understand that porting a games isn't free...Especially when the sales aren't there, because you still haven't answered why most PC aren't on Xbox then, if it is so easy to do ....You seem to see things on a solely superficial level not undertstanding that there is still a mountain of work to do to port a game, sure it is still way less than it used to be but it is still a lot of work but I'm sure you'll disagree with your usual sourceude trust me.....SO I will leave it at that since you are incapable of understanding other people opinion.

This will be my last response since this is off topic.
Here is a quote of what I said. What is wrong with it?

God of war was already delayed. It was announced to come out last year.

 

[feynoob]

I actually think it looks worse. More platforms should mean more sales. The only one with decent sales is the switch.

I have no idea on digital vs physical. It could be possible that everyone is buying digital.

Both ps and switch should have higher sales.

But the problem is that the first game was in 2018, when physical sales were hot. Now digital sales are alot better than in 2018.
Maybe that is why the sales is low.

The only one with answers at this moment is square.

 

[Corndog]

Square is lying through their teeth.

They want money upfront for their games, and they’re trying to cultivate an atmosphere where unless you pay them upfront - your system’s not guaranteed a port.

Sony didn’t offer Square money for Octopath so it didn’t appear on PlayStation.
This time they decided to “challenge” themselves by porting their bleeding edge pixel sequel to include PlayStation but not Xbox, because they want Microsoft to offer money for it.

Square knows they can’t play Nintendo and PC like that, so they don’t bother trying.

Maybe things will get better now that their president resigned.

 

[Three]

I actually think it looks worse. More platforms should mean more sales. The only one with decent sales is the switch.

I have no idea on digital vs physical. It could be possible that everyone is buying digital.

Because it was originally a switch only game but with the majority of PC and PS sales being digital you can still expect the sales to be greater than the first launch aligned despite Japan physical sales being 30k lower. Even the switch digital ratio is greater than it was 5yrs ago in 2018.

 

[Ozriel]

that is the point

Octo 1 on Game Pass = "free" exposure.

then octo 2 releases on Xbox = more sales.

that is the arguments being made.

That’s typically how you expand your audience, yes.

And you think xbox would have turned the tides? What would you have done differently? The game has good reviews and released on platforms it would sell the most on. If you think the ROI is not there on these platforms they would have only lost more on an xbox release.

Moving games to other platforms incurs only the incremental costs for porting. You can have poor ROI on primary platforms and still make enough on secondary platforms to justify port costs.

 

[Three]

Square is lying through their teeth.

They want money upfront for their games, and they’re trying to cultivate an atmosphere where unless you pay them upfront - your system’s not guaranteed a port.

Blame MS for cultivating that atmosphere for their system.

Moving games to other platforms incurs only the incremental costs for porting. You can have poor ROI on primary platforms and still make enough on secondary platforms to justify port costs.

What do you think those costs would be vs sales? Square know better than you.

 

[azertydu91]

This will be my last response since this is off topic.
Here is a quote of what I said. What is wrong with it?

The thing is nobody is saying that it has never been delayed, I said it hasn't been officialy delayed into 2023 which is different but corndog seems stuck on a loop, it's like groundhog post.

Edit: just one of the countless posts explaining that you didn't understand anything for 2 full pages.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Blame MS for cultivating that atmosphere for their system.

Just Microsoft right?

Surely it couldn’t also be Sony who never received the first Octopath despite paying Square for numerous timed exclusives.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Square "we don't know what the fuck we're doing" Enix.

They know exactly what they’re doing. They want Microsoft to pay for it.

Sony may be getting this one for free because Square already suckered them into a fat check for Forspoken.

 

[Three]

Just Microsoft right?

Surely it couldn’t also be Sony who never received the first Octopath despite paying Square for numerous timed exclusives.

What's that got to do with cultivating an atmosphere of upfront payments? That's pretty much what gamepass is cultivating on the system.

 

[SmokedMeat]

What's that got to do with cultivating an atmosphere of upfront payments? That's pretty much what gamepass is cultivating on the system.

Set your warrior gear down for a second, and remind us all again who pays Square for more timed exclusives than anyone else in the entire industry.

You think your company is innocent?? I’ve got some swamp land to sell you.

 

[VectorVictor]

Still doesn’t change the fact the reason Octopath 2 is not on Xbox because the audience in not on there. This is same reason why games like Tactics Ogre, Atelier Ryza 3, GrimGrimore Oncemore, Great Ace Attorney and even Final Fantasy Pixel Remaster is not coming to Xbox and people can’t tell me it’s because “Sony pay money for those games”.

Thats only true for FFXVI but not for those games I mention above

Believe what you like. Sounds like you made up your mind.

I'd rather wait to see some kind of official confirmation. If any money was paid, they're not allowed to discuss it. In this article, I personally think people are misreading it. But the whole thing is framed strangely so I can't blame them too much.

Exactly. Plus people forget that Sony owns a stake in SquEnix, so of course SquEnix will Kowtow to their (partial) owners.

Add to that the fact that Sony has a history of moneyhatting games to keep them exclusive, and this screams Sony propaganda more than anything else.

 

[Three]

Set your warrior gear down for a second, and remind us all again who pays Square for more timed exclusives than anyone else in the entire industry.

You think your company is innocent?? I’ve got some swamp land to sell you.

Why don't you put your warrior gear down and tell me how MS haven't cultivated upfront payments with subscriptions? You tell me who spends more, do you actually even know?

My company drop the bullshit. Nobody is even saying others are innocent of anything but just that MS have cultivated this atmosphere for their system and not the publishers taking that money.

I can name you just as many upfront payments as you can confirmed timed exclusives. Rise of the Tomb Raider, SE upfront payment for exclusivity , Outriders, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Octopath Traveller 1, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Marvel's Guardians of the Galaxy, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Life is Strange: Ture colors, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Dragon Quest, SE upfront payment for gamepass, FFXIII, SE upfront payment for gamepass, FFX SE upfront payment for gamepass...

Now tell me what's cultivated an atmosphere for upfront payments? The limited amount of timed exclusives which have happened since forever or the upfront payments for sub services happening today? What do you honestly believe has cultivated upfront payments instead of the publisher relying on its own sales?

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

"Isn't on more platforms"? It launched on 4 platforms. 5 if you count Steam Deck. What's the problem? The first game launched on 1 platform. Sold like hotcakes. I don't remember any complaints about that. Took years to go to PC/ Xbox.

If they want to do an Xbox port later down the line, absolutely nothing stopping them from doing that, unless someone paid to keep it off for a certain amount of time. Which seems unlikely. What's the audience that is asking for Octopath 2 on a platform they don't own, like who is the article written for? Xbox JRPG gamers that don't own a Switch or a PS4/5 or a PC/Steam Deck seems like a really narrow population.

This just doesn't seem like an important problem that needed this long drawn-out explanation. It's on a platform that the vast majority of console/ PC gamers at least own one of. . I just feel like it's trying to answer a question no one is asking. I wouldn't mind having Octopath II on my Series X or S, but i'm not going to buy it twice. So the most I would ever do at this point is resub to Game Pass to play it at 4K/60.

 

[Roxkis_ii]

Bro, it's like Xbox fans want Xbox to be trash. How can anyone fix their short coming by blaming someone else? It's never a problem with Xbox, it's always Sony's fault. Some how some way.

The devs didn't put their game on Xbox for a reason. It up to Xbox to figure out and fix that reason. Blaming Sony isn't going to encourage more devs to release games on Xbox.

 

[Dr. Wilkinson]

Picked it up to play on Steam Deck. It looks and plays like a dream!

Not as high fidelity on Switch, but I've got no complaints there either. It seems to run better than 1, for sure. Load times seem faster, too.

 

[Ozriel]

What do you think those costs would be vs sales? Square know better than you.

Even Square have done multiple 180s and admitted to having gotten things wrong, with respect to their games.
Some of us still remember when Japanese devs weren’t putting their games on PC.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Why don't you put your warrior gear down and tell me how MS haven't cultivated upfront payments with subscriptions? You tell me who spends more, do you actually even know?

My company drop the bullshit. Nobody is even saying others are innocent of anything but just that MS have cultivated this atmosphere for their system and not the publishers taking that money.

I can name you just as many upfront payments as you can confirmed timed exclusives. Rise of the Tomb Raider, SE upfront payment for exclusivity , Outriders, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Octopath Traveller 1, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Marvel's Guardians of the Galaxy, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Life is Strange: Ture colors, SE upfront payment for gamepass, Dragon Quest, SE upfront payment for gamepass, FFXIII, SE upfront payment for gamepass, FFX SE upfront payment for gamepass...

Now tell me what's cultivated an atmosphere for upfront payments? The limited amount of timed exclusives which have happened since forever or the upfront payments for sub services happening today? What do you honestly believe has cultivated upfront payments instead of the publisher relying on its own sales?

Timed exclusives/Game Pass are both upfront payments.

You’re pointing the finger trying to put the blame entirely on Microsoft as though they alone caused this, when Sony’s equally guilty.

I’m saying greedy Square is so used to Sony/Microsoft handing out money, that they’re now holding back on releasing a game unless they see some money upfront.

 

[Three]

You’re pointing the finger trying to put the blame entirely on Microsoft as though they alone caused this, when Sony’s equally guilty.

Drop the console war bullshit and read what was said. I never mentioned Sony or that they are innocent of anything. You're the one who is trying to drag Sony in here and make it about warrior bullshit.

I’m saying greedy Square is so used to Sony/Microsoft handing out money, that they’re now holding back on releasing a game unless they see some money upfront.

I know it's hard for you to admit but MS have cultivated that atmosphere on their system is all I said. Octopath 2 isn't releasing on PC, Switch and PS because they all paid for a port. SE didn't wait for upfront payment.

I said blame MS for the upfront payment strategy of gamepass. The subscription strategy has meant MS have used upfront payments for SE stuff being ported to their system and not relying on sales, Octopath Traveller 1, Outriders, DQ:XI S, Life is Strange, all upfront 'day one' payments instead of sales. MS have gone down this route for their system, don't blame others. blame them instead of trying to shift it to the limited amount of timed exclusives that were the norm like FF or Rise of the Tomb raider. Gamepass is the reason they are doing it. Low sales vs upfront payment from the sub service, which would you choose for that system?

 

[Torrent of Pork]

 

[Ozriel]

I know it's hard for you to admit but MS have cultivated that atmosphere on their system is all I said. Octopath 2 isn't releasing on PC, Switch and PS because they all paid for a port. SE didn't wait for upfront payment.

I said blame MS for the upfront payment strategy of gamepass. The subscription strategy has meant MS have used upfront payments for SE stuff being ported to their system and not relying on sales, Octopath Traveller 1, Outriders, DQ:XI S, Life is Strange, all upfront 'day one' payments instead of sales. MS have gone down this route for their system, don't blame others. blame them instead of trying to shift it to the limited amount of timed exclusives that were the norm like FF or Rise of the Tomb raider. Gamepass is the reason they are doing it. Low sales vs upfront payment from the sub service, which would you choose for that system?

There’s merit to pursuing the Gamepass strategy for games in genres that aren’t popular on your console. Stuff like DQ and Octopath, it makes sense. The idea is to grow the audience for content of that nature, audience that can be expected to purchase future entries in the series. That’s what Square’s supposed to test with a port.

Sega put Yakuza games on Gamepass. Still didn’t stop them from launching Yakuza 7 out of GP on the platform.

Let’s not blame Microsoft for paying for third party games to come to Gamepass. That’s just dumb. As is the claim that games like LiS and Outriders wouldn’t have sold on Xbox without a Gamepass strategy.

 

[kondorBonk]

Platform drama aside. I've finished all the character chapters and entered the hidden content last night. I love this franchise so much.

 

[YeulEmeralda]

What if I told you that you can play Switch games on PC?

 

[ungalo]

Square is lying through their teeth.

They want money upfront for their games, and they’re trying to cultivate an atmosphere where unless you pay them upfront - your system’s not guaranteed a port.

Sony didn’t offer Square money for Octopath so it didn’t appear on PlayStation.
This time they decided to “challenge” themselves by porting their bleeding edge pixel sequel to include PlayStation but not Xbox, because they want Microsoft to offer money for it.

Square knows they can’t play Nintendo and PC like that, so they don’t bother trying.

Might be true on some level because they do the most partnerships with both companies.

Perhaps people forgot about it but basically all Square Enix catalog was in Gamepass at some point, so Jez Corden trying to make it look like they have a beef is laughable.

But that's also true that for low or midbudget games Xbox releases must amount to pretty much nothing for them. And that's a problem. Doesn't concern only Square Enix.

 

[SmokedMeat]

Drop the console war bullshit and read what was said. I never mentioned Sony or that they are innocent of anything. You're the one who is trying to drag Sony in here and make it about warrior bullshit.

Give me a break. I brought up every platform in my post and pointed out that Square’s playing a game of extracting payment from either Microsoft or Sony, because BOTH pay upfront to get games on their platform/service.

You got butthurt and put the full blame on Microsoft.

Blame MS for cultivating that atmosphere for their system.

I’m blaming both, but yeah, I’m the console warrior here lol

 

[Chronicle]

I'm playing this game now on ps. A pleasant surprise. Thought if try something different. It's beautiful yet demanding. Jo hand holding.

 

[blacktout]

in other words:

Octo 1 on Game Pass + people giving it a try = exposure and virality.

octo 2 releases on Xbox (No Game Pass). and because of the "free" exposure of the first one = more sales.

the fact that Octo 2 is skipping Xbox at all is a sign that Octo 2's (I meant 1) GP engagement was low.

Oh yeah, that's a totally fair assumption to make, with or without this interview. There has to be some reason Square decided not to bring it to Xbox and/or Microsoft decided not to shell out to get it on GamePass.

My complaint was with the borderline illiterate framing of the interview in the title and tweet. We get a lot of threads like this with salacious titles that turn out to be complete bullshit once you waste a click.

 

[MacReady13]

Bro, it's like Xbox fans want Xbox to be trash. How can anyone fix their short coming by blaming someone else? It's never a problem with Xbox, it's always Sony's fault. Some how some way.

The devs didn't put their game on Xbox for a reason. It up to Xbox to figure out and fix that reason. Blaming Sony isn't going to encourage more devs to release games on Xbox.

Exactly right. They’re one of the richest companies in the world and yet they couldn’t afford to get this game on their console?!? It’s no one but Microsoft’s fault.

 

[Three]

You got butthurt and put the full blame on Microsoft.


I’m blaming both, but yeah, I’m the console warrior here lol

Nobody is butthurt. Just strongly disagree on who is "cultivating an atmosphere of upfront payments to secure ports" and I said MS strategy with gamepass has a very big hand in that so you can blame them instead of SE.

You think that Octopath 1 didn't come to PS because they were trying to get Sony specifically to pay upfront for a port but that's just bad conjecture, nobody paid for ports except for MS and gamepass, this isn't even limited to SE but extends to Sega/Atlus and other publishers.

I'm sure the Octopath producers are under no illusion of Sony paying for a port of anything. The producers did a 3DS exclusive before with Bravely Default too. Nobody paid to get that later either, didn't come to PC too. They just carried on with what they knew and did a Switch exclusive with their next game Octopath 1 where again Sony didn't pay for a port. You're turning that into something else though where SE is out there cultivating upfront payments when gamepass is paying upfront for ports. Octopath 2 came to PS and PC because they looked at feedback and game sales.

Sony didn't pay anything to get the sequel Octopath 2, they didn’t pay for Octopath 1, Bravely Default, Bravely Default: End Layer so clearly that supposed strategy of yours of getting Sony to pay for ports is clueless. MS clearly did pay upfront to get Octopath 1 straight on gamepass though as well as several other IP. Nobody else is paying for ports least of all PC but it coming to PS differs for you. Octopath 2 is relying on SE selling on these platforms on their own, no upfront payment.

Instead of simply agreeing on the fact that gamepass is all about cultivating an atmosphere of upfront payments for content on the service, which it clearly is, you're here trying to prove who isn't innocent or just as guilty for console war reasons when I didn't even mention platforms. My only point was that MS are to blame for cultivating upfront payments for ports with their subscription strategy not Square Enix.

 

[Nautilus]

Square stating something everyone already knew, but few wished to admit.

 

[Captain Toad]

iPhone

Ok, sure....

How about FF Pixel Remasters?

 

[OuterLimits]

Unfortunately the sequel is selling far worse than the first game, so the odds of any platform seeing an Octo 3 appear to be quite low.

 

[VectorVictor]

Unfortunately the sequel is selling far worse than the first game, so the odds of any platform seeing an Octo 3 appear to be quite low.

Huh…maybe if they would have put the game out on a console platform that had an audience for the first one, it would have done better?

When SquEnix puts a game out on GamePass that was popular and generated them revenue, but then cites lack of sales for the first one and doesn’t port the second, SquEnix are the problem, not Xbox gamers or the platform.

Octopath Traveler did make waves on GamePass and was definitely a top game for a while. That’s a ready-made audience for the second one…but then you don’t release the game on the next-Gen platform you built an audience with…either someone is a f*****g moron at SquEnix or one of their shareholders *cough*Sony*cough* paid money for SquEnix to not release it.

 

[TheCed]

FFXV stinks. Can’t blame anyone for not buying it.

Bought it day one... I didn't know and I have all of the regrets.
All of them !

 

[93xfan]

So what are the ps5 sales numbers? Pc?
Edit: making it run on Xbox would be trivial. Even if you thought sales would be poor you would do it anyway. How else are you going to build an audience?

It’s not like SE doesn’t have a history of giving Sony deals and keeping games off of Xbox.

FF14, FF16, FF remasters, FF7 remake, etc

 

[Torrent of Pork]

Look I know porting isn't as simple as pressing a button, but it cannot take enough effort for it to not be more profitable than the big fat nothing they're earning now.

I would call shenanigans if not for the fact that Squeenix is incompetent enough for me to believe they just didn't want to make money.

 

[Three]

Huh…maybe if they would have put the game out on a console platform that had an audience for the first one, it would have done better?

When SquEnix puts a game out on GamePass that was popular and generated them revenue, but then cites lack of sales for the first one and doesn’t port the second, SquEnix are the problem, not Xbox gamers or the platform.

Octopath Traveler did make waves on GamePass and was definitely a top game for a while. That’s a ready-made audience for the second one…but then you don’t release the game on the next-Gen platform you built an audience with…either someone is a f*****g moron at SquEnix or one of their shareholders *cough*Sony*cough* paid money for SquEnix to not release it.

You think SE don't have engagement numbers from GP?

It’s not like SE doesn’t have a history of giving Sony deals and keeping games off of Xbox.

FF14, FF16, FF remasters, FF7 remake, etc

FF14 didn't have a deal, neither did FF Pixel remasters

 

[Danjin44]

FF14 didn't have a deal, neither did FF Pixel remasters

I remember the reasons FF14 was exclusive to Playstation because SE couldn’t make deal with Microsoft for their online policy, I could be remembering wrong.

 

[Three]

I remember the reasons FF14 was exclusive to Playstation because SE couldn’t make deal with Microsoft for their online policy, I could be remembering wrong.

Exactly, it was MS' own server policy and crossplay. Doesn’t stop people blaming others for MS' own mistakes.

https://www.videogameschronicle.com...Fantasy 14 is,with Square Enix RPG Forespoken.

 

[Deerock71]

He said it didn't release on "other platforms" because of low sales for those games.

Let's see. Octopath Traveler 2 released on PlayStation, Switch and PC. What other platforms do you really think he was referring to?

 

[93xfan]

You think SE don't have engagement numbers from GP?


FF14 didn't have a deal, neither did FF Pixel remasters

I’ll take your word on 14, but how do you know about the Pixel remasters? They’re probably not going to say if there was a deal

 

[Captain Toad]

I’ll take your word on 14, but how do you know about the Pixel remasters? They’re probably not going to say if there was a deal

They actually had to reveal those deals because of the Activision trial. I don’t think there was a deal for Pixel Remasters.

And there definitely was no deal for 14. SquareEnix tried to put it on Xbox originally, but Microsoft wouldn't allow cross-play (Sony would), so they told them no.

 

[Deleted member 471617]

And you think xbox would have turned the tides? What would you have done differently? The game has good reviews and released on platforms it would sell the most on. If you think the ROI is not there on these platforms they would have only lost more on an xbox release.

I don't think anything would turn around sales for Octopath Traveler 2 simply because since last September, Square Enix has released way too many games that all cater to the same audience and because of that, some of them won't meet expectations because that audience isn't going to buy every one of them.

As for Xbox, it's all X86 architecture. Both PS5/XS are form factor PC's. Porting the game should be easy and cheap. If anything, it's more Square Enix just not knowing how to run to their company. They don't have a clue whatsoever.

What I would do differently is simple - accept every Game Pass or PlayStation Plus day one deal I can get and if not day one, six months after release, make every game outside of what's already contracted to Sony multi-platform and most of all, spread out the lineup. Look below (only for PlayStation 5) -

Game Companies - Square Enix - GameFAQs

Game Companies - Square Enix on GameFAQs

gamefaqs.gamespot.com

10 games and 3 expansions in 10 months.

Game Companies - Square Enix - GameFAQs

Game Companies - Square Enix on GameFAQs

gamefaqs.gamespot.com

Add in 2023 and through April, it's 14 games and 5 expansions in 14 months. Outside of Outriders Worldslayer and Powerwash Simulator, the audience for everything else is the same. Some games/purchases will be sacrificed by this audience because again, Square Enix doesn't know what they're doing.

 

[Captain Toad]

What I would do differently is simple - accept every Game Pass or PlayStation Plus day one deal I can get

But Microsoft and Sony don't offer these deals blindly. Microsoft has the data from Octopath Traveler 1 on GamePass. I imagine the attach rate there is low that they weren't offering much if anything for the sequel. If so, it doesn't make sense for SE to do that either.

 

[Deleted member 471617]

But Microsoft and Sony don't offer these deals blindly. Microsoft has the data from Octopath Traveler 1 on GamePass. I imagine the attach rate there is low that they weren't offering much if anything for the sequel. If so, it doesn't make sense for SE to do that either.

True but that's also why I said six months later. If Guardians of the Galaxy can go on Game Pass six months after release, I don't see why any of these small JRPG's would be a problem unless Square Enix is asking for way too much money. But it is what it is I guess.

 

[93xfan]

They actually had to reveal those deals because of the Activision trial. I don’t think there was a deal for Pixel Remasters.

And there definitely was no deal for 14. SquareEnix tried to put it on Xbox originally, but Microsoft wouldn't allow cross-play (Sony would), so they told them no.

Are the deals that were revealed timed exclusives? Will FF7R ever come to Xbox, for example?

 

[Captain Toad]

Are the deals that were revealed timed exclusives? Will FF7R ever come to Xbox, for example?

I don't think so, but I don't know. I never thought FF7 would go to Xbox and it did (just 15-20 years late, lol).

FF16 is a 6 month timed exclusive, but then likely only for PC. Yoshi P said they don't expect to have it ready by then though.

You never know. Stuff like Nier Automata was never supposed to go to Xbox. Not because of Sony, just because they didn't think it would sell. But, it exceeded expectations so much on PS4 that they deemed it big enough to port to XBO.

 

[Torrent of Pork]

So with roughly 100 million sales between Xbone and Series consoles Squeenix organically didn't think it was worth putting out a port?

 

[Captain Toad]

So with roughly 100 million sales between Xbone and Series consoles Squeenix organically didn't think it was worth putting out a port?

You think Series sales are at 50 million?

Believe it or not, but they have the data. They know what makes financial sense and what doesn't. These games just don't do well on Xbox, for whatever reason.