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[Mister Wolf]

Time for platinum to bend the knee.

 

[PJX]

On an individual level, there's probably some small scale theft that happens

What people are claiming here though? No. It's not a regular occurance

You're right. It may not happen on a regular scale but it definitely isn't some small scale theft. I'll leave it as that.

 

[Marvel]

It looked shit.

 

[Enjay]

I love how platinum has made enough duds that common sense now offsets their fanatics' claims.

 

[bushwookie]

Exceptionally mature of him to take this position.

That said, if Platinum didn't have the chops and the experience to build the game with the online features MS wanted, MS could have cut back on those features and focused on the core SP game which is a dev team like Platinum Games' core strength.

To me, if a dev known for SP games primarily, is failing to execute on something that's outside of their comfort zone, i.e. MP, it's on the game producer (and by proxy the publisher) to rejig the scope of the project to play to the dev's strengths. Why even contract Platinum in the first place if you want them to make something they have very little experience making? Why not contract a dev with more experience in MP games?

If MP was so important, they could have brought in another studio to help with the MP modes. Cancelling the game was premature and showed that MS Games Studios at some point stopped believing in the project, which probably had more to do with where they saw the project fitting into their publisher portfolio than anything else.

I mean, MGS bankrolled the abortion that was fucking Crackdown. I'd much rather have had a scaled-down SP-only Scalebound than that POS.

It is simply baffling to me that you came to that conclusion.

Throughout the whole ordeal, these are the undeniable established facts.
• MS and Platinum announce Scalebound.
• Scalebound gets canceled.
• Kamiya shits all over MS on twitter regarding Scalebound.
• Several years later, Kamiya finally acknowledges that that it canceled due to his team's lack of ability.

How did you come to the conclusion that Kamiya is "exceptionally mature", as well as to believe that despite his comments... That MS is still really the one to blame here?

MS didn't force him as if at gunpoint, to make a multiplayer component that ended up wrecking the entire project. That's not it works. MS paid them several millions of dollars to provide a game Platinum agreed to make. MS may have requested a multiplayer component be added to it, but Platinum would've had to agree to implement it. (That would've almost certainly included a price increase).

You can attempt to push the blame on MS for wanting multiplayer all you want, but the fact is that MS paid millions for a game they didn't deliver. Like you mentioned, despite several years worth of delays, and cut features... MS gave Crackdown all the time and money any dev could ask for.

 

[Lethal01]

Remember when everyone used to shit on this game at every single public showcase, before it was suddenly cancelled and then according to some it became the "greatest game that never was" overnight?

I remember that it was the only Microsoft game that got me excited from its announcement to its cancellation.

 

[Lethal01]

It's really nice of Kamiya to try to should all the blame of Microsoft's fuck up.

Too late, i blocked him.

woah, Kamiya is such a pro he's getting people to block themselves for him.

 

[Drizzlehell]

A developer actually steps up and speaks the truth.

Imagine if CD Project Red or Rockstar had said something similar.

CDPR did.

 

[Clear]

It is simply baffling to me that you came to that conclusion.

Throughout the whole ordeal, these are the undeniable established facts.
• MS and Platinum announce Scalebound.
• Scalebound gets canceled.
• Kamiya shits all over MS on twitter regarding Scalebound.
• Several years later, Kamiya finally acknowledges that that it canceled due to his team's lack of ability.

How did you come to the conclusion that Kamiya is "exceptionally mature", as well as to believe that despite his comments... That MS is still really the one to blame here?

MS didn't force him as if at gunpoint, to make a multiplayer component that ended up wrecking the entire project. That's not it works. MS paid them several millions of dollars to provide a game Platinum agreed to make. MS may have requested a multiplayer component be added to it, but Platinum would've had to agree to implement it. (That would've almost certainly included a price increase).

You can attempt to push the blame on MS for wanting multiplayer all you want, but the fact is that MS paid millions for a game they didn't deliver. Like you mentioned, despite several years worth of delays, and cut features... MS gave Crackdown all the time and money any dev could ask for.

Serious question: Why are you stanning so hard for nameless members of a huge organization at a time when nearly all their external projects were underperforming, over a director with an unbroken string of commercial/critical hits going all the way back to the PS1 days with Res Evil 2?

Xbox studios seem to have gotten their act together nowadays but throughout the late 360 and the majority of the Xb1 era their output was by and large the drizzling shits. This is a project that was signed when they were still trying to push Kinect as a thing and fucking themselves and their partners over in the process.

They get FROM, creators of the Armored Core series to do a mech game for them and they end up with an unplayable abortion like Steel Battalion*. They try to make a "spiritual successor" to Panzer Dragoon and they end up with the mediocrity that was Crimson Dragon because again it was saddled with that shitty peripheral. They try and resurrect Phantom Dust -as an esports thing- and shocker(!) that dies on its arse and never gets finished. Although they do manage to save face a bit by adding the original to their BC program.

They actually managed to ReCore out the door, but again this was in such a poor state that they had to do a "definitive edition" reissue a year later to bring it up to scratch.

Meanwhile, there's the ongoing debacles of Crackdown and Fable, two more significant exclusive franchises that they manage to kill through trying to shoe-horn them into over-arching business strategies. Cloud with the former, GaaS/FTP/Kinect for the other.

There's a pattern here, and its not difficult to identify!

The plain truth is easier to single out the projects that did actually run smooth for Xbox around that time, because they are the outliers. They even managed to scuff the launch of the Halo collection ffs!

Not saying the situation persists today, just that its impossible to honestly appraise that whole period without recognizing that there were problems way all the way through their development effort. If Scalebound was the only high-profile cancellation around then, then sure I could give some credence to Kamiya being primarily responsible, but it wasn't close to the only project that went awry or tits-up altogether.


*Yes this was technically published by Capcom, but with it being Kinect XGS had their fingerprints all over it. You could say the same for the now mostly forgotten Fighter Within, which was published by Ubisoft as an XB1 launch title.

 

[Shut0wen]

Hideki Kamiya apologises to Microsoft for Scalebound’s cancellation | VGC

“We weren’t experienced enough,” confesses the PlatinumGames director…

www.videogameschronicle.com

Honestly never understood why Microsoft got shit for cancelling this title, it was an incredible jump from bayonetta 2 to this, same for why konami gets shit for getting rid of hideo since he rinced konami dry with money and hideo to this day still hasnt said shit cause he knows his dismissal was justified even when konami is a shitty company

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

It is simply baffling to me that you came to that conclusion.

Throughout the whole ordeal, these are the undeniable established facts.
• MS and Platinum announce Scalebound.
• Scalebound gets canceled.
• Kamiya shits all over MS on twitter regarding Scalebound.
• Several years later, Kamiya finally acknowledges that that it canceled due to his team's lack of ability.

How did you come to the conclusion that Kamiya is "exceptionally mature", as well as to believe that despite his comments... That MS is still really the one to blame here?

MS didn't force him as if at gunpoint, to make a multiplayer component that ended up wrecking the entire project. That's not it works. MS paid them several millions of dollars to provide a game Platinum agreed to make. MS may have requested a multiplayer component be added to it, but Platinum would've had to agree to implement it. (That would've almost certainly included a price increase).

You can attempt to push the blame on MS for wanting multiplayer all you want, but the fact is that MS paid millions for a game they didn't deliver. Like you mentioned, despite several years worth of delays, and cut features... MS gave Crackdown all the time and money any dev could ask for.

Kamiya I see him as a prissy child with a tantrum who due to his attacks of anger does not think about the consequences, there he is at least acknowledging.

So if we can define this man as being immature in his behavior.

 

[Ryu Kaiba]

Nintendo should buy PG, c'mon Nintendo, lock them up

would be a fun announcement but I think that options off the table with Tencent pouring money into Platinum.

 

[Castef]

Is Microsoft going to acquire Platinum?

Nah, they are building a team for Itagaki. I said.

 

[Castef]

- I apologize to Microsoft
- So, are you porting The Wonderful 101 to Xbox now?
- AHAHAHAHAHAH!

 

[MonarchJT]

Because bridges were obviously burned 4 years ago. Just because he's coming out and taking his part of the blame to heal relations doesn't somehow mean MS wasn't at fault too.

just shut up we have one of the most (albeit brilliant) arrogant developers around (we know how he behaves on Twitter) who is official apologizing directly to Microsoft and you still have the nerve to babble like some of you have for years (not knowing the facts) about MS's alleged faults. this is completely FUD. Stoo being dull, accept the reality

 

[Leyasu]

Game got shown at e3, looked shit and everyone agreed.

Game got cancelled, became the most anticipated game of all time and Microsoft lost about a gazillion console sales from all the blue rats that were no longer going to buy an Xbox because scalebound was dead

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

just shut up we have one of the most (albeit brilliant) arrogant developers around (we know how he behaves on Twitter) who is official apologizing directly to Microsoft and you still have the nerve to babble like some of you have for years (not knowing the facts) about MS's alleged faults. this is completely FUD. Stoo being dull, accept the reality

Learn to read. He's owning up to his own mistakes. Not accepting full blame. They had already said it was both parties who were at fault years ago

Or do you think MS was inncocent for all the other mismanaged projects they had back then too?

You're drunk again. Get help

 

[MonarchJT]

Learn to read. He's owning up to his own mistakes. Not accepting full blame. They had already said it was both parties who were at fault years ago

Or do you think MS was inncocent for all the other mismanaged projects they had back then too?

You're drunk again. Get help

What do you mean by mismanagement? quantify ms errors? Microsoft could set goas that were reviewed every x time ... obviously these goals were not respected.
In what language do you think ms's fault

"We were developing on the Unreal engine, we also lacked the necessary know-how to build a game based on online features."

"The hurdles we had to overcome were very big. We weren’t experienced enough and couldn’t get over that wall, leading to what happened in the end. ’m sorry to the players who looked forward to it, and moreover I’m sorry to Microsoft who had placed their trust in us as a business partner. I want to apologize both as a creator and as a member of PlatinumGames.”
Stop writing nonsense

for the last line i reports u

 

[Jaguar Victory]

Those who followed this game closely knew this already. It's a shame as I was looking forward to it. It would actually be makeable on XBOX Series X. No way XBOX One was pulling that off.

 

[Painskiller]

Never too late. Make the game if its really that important to you.

But multiplatform or only on PlayStation, cuz failed on Wii and Xbox One

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

What do you mean by mismanagement? quantify ms errors? Microsoft could set goas that were reviewed every x time ... obviously these goals were not respected.
In what language do you think ms's fault

"We were developing on the Unreal engine, we also lacked the necessary know-how to build a game based on online features."

"The hurdles we had to overcome were very big. We weren’t experienced enough and couldn’t get over that wall, leading to what happened in the end. ’m sorry to the players who looked forward to it, and moreover I’m sorry to Microsoft who had placed their trust in us as a business partner. I want to apologize both as a creator and as a member of PlatinumGames.”
Stop writing nonsense

for the last line i reports u

Phantom Dust, Fable Legends, Crackdown, Halo MCC, Scalebound. All mismanaged products and all within the same timeframe

Have you ever worked a day in your life? If I set you goals that you agree with but fail to meet, that doesn't mean the entire blame falls on you. I have a responsibility to set reasonable goals you can meet. You have the responsibility to understand your own capabilities and tell me if you can't meet them.

Multimillion-dollar projects like this do not go tits up because of one person. It's never that simple and you're just a fool if you think a PR statement from Kamiya somehow gives you the full picture.

 

[MonarchJT]

Phantom Dust, Fable Legends, Crackdown, Halo MCC, Scalebound. All mismanaged products and all within the same timeframe

Have you ever worked a day in your life? If I set you goals that you agree with but fail to meet, that doesn't mean the entire blame falls on you. I have a responsibility to set reasonable goals you can meet. You have the responsibility to understand your own capabilities and tell me if you can't meet them.

Multimillion-dollar projects like this do not go tits up because of one person. It's never that simple and you're just a fool if you think a PR statement from Kamiya somehow gives you the full picture.

every case is different you are generalizing in total ignorance. Scalebound was a devs fault. They admitted it. Open other thread for the other games if you know something more than generalize about mismanagement

 

[M1chl]

Phantom Dust, Fable Legends, Crackdown, Halo MCC, Scalebound. All mismanaged products and all within the same timeframe

Have you ever worked a day in your life? If I set you goals that you agree with but fail to meet, that doesn't mean the entire blame falls on you. I have a responsibility to set reasonable goals you can meet. You have the responsibility to understand your own capabilities and tell me if you can't meet them.

Multimillion-dollar projects like this do not go tits up because of one person. It's never that simple and you're just a fool if you think a PR statement from Kamiya somehow gives you the full picture.

IF I am not wrong, back before 2018, the funding for xbox division was very low, so I think that is a main factor for this mismanagement back in the day. But it sucks, they should resume some of these failed projects.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

every case is different you are generalizing in total ignorance. Scalebound was a devs fault. They admitted it.

No. They already came out and said both sides were responsible years ago.

Kamiya apologised for his own failures. That's not admitting they were the only party to blame.

 

[bender]

Nah, they are building a team for Itagaki. I said.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

IF I am not wrong, back before 2018, the funding for xbox division was very low, so I think that is a main factor for this mismanagement back in the day. But it sucks, they should resume some of these failed projects.

Yup. No doubt they had limited funds so they were forced to prioritise. The entire Xbox division was mismanaged by Microsoft at the top, not so much Phil and Co

 

[MonarchJT]

No. They already came out and said both sides were responsible years ago.

Kamiya apologised for his own failures. That's not admitting they were the only party to blame.

re read what Kamiya said then come back there is little they can do if the devs admit they have accepted a job for which they did not have enough technical experience. Obviously, icrosott could call another team in support but did they have the funds? probably not. They were forced to apologize and take their blame (which Xbox users respect anyway) but technically there was little they could do. The bulk of the faults are gods Platinum. You just can't resist not going vs Microsoft continues as well.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

re read what Kamiya said then come back there is little they can do if the devs admit they have accepted a job for which they did not have enough technical experience. Obviously, icrosott could call another team in support but did they have the funds? probably not. They were forced to apologize and take their blame (which Xbox users respect anyway) but technically there was little they could do. The bulk of the faults are gods Platinum. You just can't resist not going vs Microsoft continues as well.

Get a job, understand how responsibility works, then come back. And yes there was plenty of things MS could do. If the multiplayer requirement was something that MS requested as rumoured, then they could have removed that. Again, goal setting works both ways

And drop the bullshit that this is about hating on Microsoft or something. It's pathetic

 

[MonarchJT]

Get a job, understand how responsibility works, then come back

And drop the bullshit that this is about hating on Microsoft or something. It's pathetic

stop getting personal i don't know you and you don't know me . If you have no idea how to talk to people and can't accept other people's ideas and facts, avoid posting.reported again

 

[ParaSeoul]

Actual translation: Please hire us again,I don't want to work for Tencent.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

stop getting personal i don't know you and you don't know me . If you have no idea how to talk to people and can't accept other people's ideas and facts, avoid posting.reported again

That's rich given you responded to me first being antagonistic

Take your own advice

 

[MonarchJT]

That's rich given you responded to me first being antagonistic

Take your own advice

your post was a complete generalization about everything, Microsoft, the problem, what Kamiya said and paradoxically about me too (and insulting) . Which makes anything you've written about it unusable for conversation. Bye

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

your post was a complete generalization about everything, Microsoft, the problem, what Kamiya said and paradoxically about me too (and insulting) . Which makes anything you've written about it unusable for conversation. Bye

You jumped into this thread days late to tell me to shut up. You have absolutely no right to be offended.

Now report yourself for being toxic and then get help you alcoholic

 

[MonarchJT]

You jumped into this thread days late to tell me to shut up. You have absolutely no right to be offended.

Now report yourself for being toxic and then get help you alcoholic

I did it because you simply don't have the basis to say what you said .... especially when the head of Platinum games writes what we've all read. as i said about scalebound the bulk of the problem is derived from Platinum. if you want to talk about something else and how Microsoft has mismanaged other project open other threads. But it doesn't change that the Platinum was the problem here. If you know anything about THIS game that has not yet been revealed and that would put Microsoft in complete error as well as your guesswork enlighten us.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

I did it because you simply don't have the basis to say what you said .... especially when the head of Platinum games writes what we've all read. as i said about scalebound the bulk of the problem is derived from the Platinum. if you want to talk about something else. and how Microsoft has mismanaged other project open other threads.

You can justify it however you want. Don't bitch and whine that you're not being treated with respect when you jump into threads days late to start a fight

This topic is about the mismanagment of Scalebound. Microsoft is also responsible for managing Scalebound, as they were for all the other games that were mismanaged. If you want to talk about blame and all that crap, then it's completely relevant to look at other projects that Microsoft were responsible for.

 

[MonarchJT]

You can justify it however you want. Don't bitch and whine that you're not being treated with respect if you don't do it yourself.

This topic is about the mismanagment of Scalebound. Microsoft is also responsible for managing Scalebound, as they were for all the other games that were mismanaged. If you want to talk about blame and all that crap, then it's completely relevant to look at other projects that Microsoft were responsible for.

Is weird because you don't see ppl crying about how Sony mismanaged the release of Agent .... or the trainwreck development that was The last Guardian ..or the never born Deep Down (all third party exclusives) and certainly unlike you, you will not see me go to certain threads to blame Sony without any concrete proof but. just guesswork.... etc etc.You have been writing on the forum for years and it is easy to understand what the problem is here.

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

Is weird because you don't see ppl crying about how Sony mismanaged the release of Agent .... or the trainwreck development that was The last Guardian ..or the never born Deep Down and certainly unlike you, you will not see me go to certain threads to blame Sony without any concrete proof but. just guesswork.... etc etc.You have been writing on the forum for years and it is easy to understand what the problem is here.

What the fuck does this have to do with Sony?

The Last Guardian was mismanaged
Agent was mismanaged
Deep Down (even though it has fuck all to do with Sony) was mismanaged

Does that make you feel better? If you want to go into those deeper, then start a thread about them.

Take your fanboy goggles off. This has nothing to do with console wars.

 

[tassletine]

I think his high sense of honour blinds him to the fact that MS could fuck up a cannonball. They have a track record of cockblocking companies and have a notorious reputation.

Although this is unsubstantiated, I'm of the belief that they kept Platinum spinning plates for years to keep them away from Nintendo -- Where they unsurprisingly still manage to produce classics.

 

[cireza]

I'm of the belief that they kept Platinum spinning plates for years to keep them away from Nintendo

Why the fuck would Microsoft do this ?

This thread is unbelievable.

 

[MonarchJT]

I think his high sense of honour blinds him to the fact that MS could fuck up a cannonball. They have a track record of cockblocking companies and have a notorious reputation.

Although this is unsubstantiated, I'm of the belief that they kept Platinum spinning plates for years to keep them away from Nintendo -- Where they unsurprisingly still manage to produce classics.

absolutely fantasyland this is what produced this fud about mismanagement narratives carried on without meaning. Did you read what Kamiya just wrote????

 

[MonarchJT]

What the fuck does this have to do with Sony?

The Last Guardian was mismanaged
Agent was mismanaged
Deep Down (even though it has fuck all to do with Sony) was mismanaged

Does that make you feel better? If you want to go into those deeper, then start a thread about them.

Take your fanboy goggles off. This has nothing to do with console wars.

the focus on that post was "without any concrete proof"

 

[Clear]

Although this is unsubstantiated, I'm of the belief that they kept Platinum spinning plates for years to keep them away from Nintendo -- Where they unsurprisingly still manage to produce classics.

Nah, they just fucked it up. Same as they did with pretty much every other external project out of Japan. XGS track record speaks for itself, when else did they manage to successfully launch a new IP from a Japanese dev?

 

[tassletine]

Nah, they just fucked it up. Same as they did with pretty much every other external project out of Japan. XGS track record speaks for itself, when else did they manage to successfully launch a new IP from a Japanese dev?

 

[Ass of Can Whooping]

the focus on that post was "without any concrete proof"

No, the focus of the post was you spouting fanboy nonsense, hence why most of it was about Sony

Get a grip

Below is the reality of game development. The only ignorant one here arguing without concrete proof is yourself

Scalebound Cancellation Was at Both Platinum and Microsoft's Fault, Says Platinum Head

The fault for Scalebound's cancellation shouldn't solely be at Microsoft's feet, says Platinum Games studio head Atsushi Inaba.

www.dualshockers.com

 

[tassletine]

Nah, they just fucked it up. Same as they did with pretty much every other external project out of Japan. XGS track record speaks for itself, when else did they manage to successfully launch a new IP from a Japanese dev?

I'm not saying that they're not incompetent but at the highest level those things are always considered. Any advantage in business is weighed up heavily when you're talking millions.
There would most likely have been a time when XGS knew that the project wasn't going anywhere but it was advantageous to them to hold onto the company.
I am biased though, as I know someone who was put in a holding pattern by MS for years.

 

[Slicker than your average]

It always looked like shit. Some edgelord with headphones on fighting dragons with a sword.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

I think his high sense of honour blinds him to the fact that MS could fuck up a cannonball. They have a track record of cockblocking companies and have a notorious reputation.

Although this is unsubstantiated, I'm of the belief that they kept Platinum spinning plates for years to keep them away from Nintendo -- Where they unsurprisingly still manage to produce classics.

Moronic take when the literal intervew is about taking responsibility.

You either need to learn to read or get your head out of your own ass. No one cares about this stealth fanboy stuff its corny find a new hobby. MS = Bad is played tf out.

 

[Jeff Spicoli]

how about not apologizing for the money you stole from MS and make the game still from all the money you took and release it on Xbox already ?

Blocked

 

[tassletine]

Moronic take when the literal intervew is about taking responsibility.

You either need to learn to read or get your head out of your own ass. No one cares about this stealth fanboy stuff its corny find a new hobby. MS = Bad is played tf out.

Moronic take when the literal intervew is about taking responsibility.

You either need to learn to read or get your head out of your own ass. No one cares about this stealth fanboy stuff its corny find a new hobby. MS = Bad is played tf out.

And you obviously know very little about Japanese culture and saving face. He is completely correct that they didn't have the capabilities to rise to the challenge that Microsoft presented, which he is clearly ashamed about.
I have admitted that this is all speculation so don't see anything moronic about my comments in that context. It's not true/ true? I really couldn't give a toss

Your response however IS moronic, in the context of open conversation (speculation) drawing it back towards console war bullshit, which you accuse me of. Trying to start a fight.

Learn to punctuate and spell. It might help with your comprehension.

 

[Max Payne’s Baretta]

And you obviously know very little about Japanese culture and saving face. He is completely correct that they didn't have the capabilities to rise to the challenge that Microsoft presented, which he is clearly ashamed about.
I have admitted that this is all speculation so don't see anything moronic about my comments in that context. It's not true/ true? I really couldn't give a toss

Your response however IS moronic, in the context of open conversation (speculation) drawing it back towards console war bullshit, which you accuse me of. Trying to start a fight.

Learn to punctuate and spell. It might help with your comprehension.

Womp womp . You tried though.