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Activision CEO says Nintendo's next console is close to PS4/Xbox One in terms of power.
- Thread starter Spyxos
- Start date
Raploz
Member
Consoles running around 200 watts vs Switch 2 at 15 watts probably. Even the ROG Ally barely surpasses a base PS4 at 30 watts in performance mode and 1:30h battery life. It also can't even match a PS5 at 720p, even while being the most advanced portable "console" right now.
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Lol, imagine if when PS5 and XSX specs were being discussed, we got comments like:
WTF Sony!? Another home console!? Are they really gonna keep us tethered to the TV? Again, Sony is always lagging 2 generations behind in the portable generation race. SMH. And the sad thing is fans lap it up.
Uh, yeah. Why would Sony NOT make a home console. And in the same vein. Why would Nintendo NOT make a portable console? Think for a second?
WTF Sony!? Another home console!? Are they really gonna keep us tethered to the TV? Again, Sony is always lagging 2 generations behind in the portable generation race. SMH. And the sad thing is fans lap it up.
Uh, yeah. Why would Sony NOT make a home console. And in the same vein. Why would Nintendo NOT make a portable console? Think for a second?
Mr Branding
Member
Battery life is where it’s at. I’m playing way more on Switch because that lasts for two sessions while I mostly use my Deck plugged in, so…
UltimaKilo
Gold Member
Hopefully it's slightly more powerful than gen 8 + DLSS so we can get some ports on Nintendo's next console.
Fatal Chuck Yeager
Member
If this is true, if, I don't think people understand how bad that is considering that the Switch was considered to be stronger than Wii U and closer to Xbox One and PS4 back in 2017, so if this is still not there and still "close" we are looking at a marginal upgrade with the only big improvements possibly being resolution and battery life with a slight uptick in performance. if this is true.
Basically, it would barely be a Switch Pro, but it will be the successor console instead.
Basically, it would barely be a Switch Pro, but it will be the successor console instead.
UltimaKilo
Gold Member
Or we have gotten to the point of demising returns, and more power is no longer needed, especially with DLSS and FSR.
Fatal Chuck Yeager
Member
You think a Switch being "close" to Xbox One form 2013 is a sign of diminishing returns and more power is no longer needed because of two things you don't understand that don't remove the need for more power?
ShadyAcshuns
Member
If true then it's likely another hybrid design, which I'm so hoping it will be.
Zannegan
Member
The Switch's GPU, docked, has about 1/3 of an Xbox One's power. If it were to match a PS4, that'd be over a 4x jump. If it matched the Pro, that'd be closer to 9x, and that's just in teraflops, not considering the advantages of newer hardware (or, to be fair, the disadvantages of a mobile RAM setup). We could be looking at a full generational leap here...
...but looking at the Steam Deck and the ROG Ally--the very best other hardware makers could do at a higher price point than Nintendo will want to hit--I wouldn't hold my breath for a 10x leap in performance for $400 in 2024.
UltimaKilo
Gold Member
No, because I have eyes and have seen the sales number for the Switch and it's software, along with the quality that is coming from those titles far exceed those on more powerful hardware, that is not particularly much more graphically impressive.
Guerilla Munch
Member
they'll release the next Zelda in 2030 and it will have 720p 30fps PS4 graphics and will win GotG and all the PS7 owners Xbox Series Z+ owners will be punching the air and gnashing their teeth again
daveonezero
Banned
Ps5 graphics aren’t even possible or being delivered on PS5.
RCU005
Member
If Nintendo is making a hybrid again, I’m willing to bet that they will have a dock that improve the specs for TV mode this time. Kind of like PS4 when portable and PS4 Pro when docked.
Personally, I would love it if they return to TV only console, but their portable market is too big to leave it out. I also don’t think they will want to have two consoles again since that would break up their developers again into different teams.
Personally, I would love it if they return to TV only console, but their portable market is too big to leave it out. I also don’t think they will want to have two consoles again since that would break up their developers again into different teams.
Rendered Tangent
Banned
Are the people in charge at Nintendo so cheap they simply refuse to invest in their most important money maker?
Why on earth, when you are as profitable as they are, do you release something that was dated at release 10 years ago?
Genuinely, I'm perplexed by such timid behaviour.
They have some incredible I.P, a devoted fan base, vast resources, and instead of offering something that can facilitate the vision of creative developers, they offer something that will be a dinosaur by the time it has been out 5 or 6 years.
I mean, imagine Breath of the Wild or the sequel at 4k 60, or even 1440-120, with everything turned up, or Mario, or Metroid.
I just cannot understand this kind of thinking.
Why on earth, when you are as profitable as they are, do you release something that was dated at release 10 years ago?
Genuinely, I'm perplexed by such timid behaviour.
They have some incredible I.P, a devoted fan base, vast resources, and instead of offering something that can facilitate the vision of creative developers, they offer something that will be a dinosaur by the time it has been out 5 or 6 years.
I mean, imagine Breath of the Wild or the sequel at 4k 60, or even 1440-120, with everything turned up, or Mario, or Metroid.
I just cannot understand this kind of thinking.
Doctor Hades
Member
Nintendo used to technologically competitive until the Wii. That console saw them strike gold as motion-controlled gaming became a big thing and after that their focus was trying to maintain that momentum and sales. The Wii U was flop, badly marketed at a time when motion-controlled gaming was dying a quiet death, but they managed to hit gold again with the Switch by combining their handheld and console strategies into one unit.
It's obviously a winning formula and because of the handheld limitations it means the future hardware based on this strategy will never compete with Microsoft's or Sony's offerings. The best we can hope for, if the next console is Switch 2 and really it cannot be anything else in my opinion as the DS is no more, is that Nintendo incorporate some kind of extra chip or hardware into the dock for TV use that can enhance the games to an acceptable visual level for 4K TVs, something the Switch does not and cannot do because it is restricted to 1080p and most games do not even render at that resolution natively.
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Hudo
Member
systemr123
Banned
Maybe think about battery life for a portable? You can’t have ps5 graphics and use the device for 5 or 6 hours without a huge external power supply/battery.
Nintendo tries to pack as much power in an as small and low usage of energy package as possible. The reactions I see in this thread about lack of power are absolutely baffling. Having e.g. ps4 power in a 720p handheld is absolutely amazing if the battery also lasts for at least 3 to 5 hours.
Madserb2023
Member
This is better than I thought and you would have to be either technically illiterate or be living on the moon to think it would have been Series S level lol. Firstly the Switch 2 is going to be likely small and thin similar to what we have now which will impact thermals even when docked. It isn't going to be chunky like the Steam Deck. Nintendo will also unsurprisingly want a decent battery life. I am currently getting about 6 hours out of the OLED while playing TOTK. Switch 2 is going to target a similar battery life. These PC handhelds last for no more than an hour in some cases. Nintendo hasn't had cutting edge tech since the Gamecube and even if they did this time around, the design would still limit the power below what people expect. They could add a GPU in the dock but then you will be looking at a very expensive system.
Rendered Tangent
Banned
Rendered Tangent
Banned
I get all that, I do.
But, I just can't help feeling these Nintendo developmers are being hamstrung by such underpowered hardware.
Like I said, imagine the new Zelda series running at 4k60 with all the bells and whistles running at high settings.
Yes, the PS4 can produce great looking games, no question.
However, this is a machine that may well have to last 6, 7, 8 years... maybe longer.
It just feels like Nintendo are being cheap and unimaginative, playing it safe - like their thinking is stuck in a different time.
What on earth makes them think releasing technology decades behind the current systems is in any way a positive response to the offering of their competition?
Then again, maybe that's it - maybe they feel like they have no direct competition and that's the way they like it.
Avoid getting entangled with Sony and Microsoft, and the pc crowd, stay in their own corner with their back to everyone else jealousy guarding the market share they posses, and keep the money rolling in.
Churn out another 5 Mario games with varying gameplay mechanics, throw in another Zelda, some Metroid, a Pokémon title or two, whatever else they can show horn in...same old same old.
Like I said, it just feels lazy and uninspired, and frankly a little cowardly.
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BlackTron
Member
It's bizarre to me that anyone would have hoped for anything better for a new Switch. People scoff at this, while maybe not realizing what a massive upgrade in power this would actually be. We got TotK on an old crappy phone chip, now Nintendo will have a PS4 to work on and we complain?
Base PS4 power was also my assumption, of course being a more modern/newer device it will be better than than comparison on paper. I think anyone who expects much more power than this in a handheld device from Nintendo, just neither understands hardware nor N's strategy going back decades.
Did anyone really expect a new handheld that was a PS5 or something? Maybe for $1500+ lol
Base PS4 power was also my assumption, of course being a more modern/newer device it will be better than than comparison on paper. I think anyone who expects much more power than this in a handheld device from Nintendo, just neither understands hardware nor N's strategy going back decades.
Did anyone really expect a new handheld that was a PS5 or something? Maybe for $1500+ lol
01011001
Banned
It's hard to judge how much the full Orin chip would cost Nintendo in a mass produced handheld.
if they somehow manage to squeeze the Orin 32GB (of course with reduced memory, but that's the chip's name sadly) in there we could have something close to Series S in docked mode (at 40 watts, vs Series S' 74 watts)
if they only use the Orin NX then it's indeed basically PS4 level raster performance in docked.
handheld mode is of course a complete mystery as it's hard to predict which clock speeds they'll use there.
and either chip would outperform the PS4 easily on a subjective level thanks to DLSS and decent RT hardware.
absolute worst case scenario is if they use the Orin Nano, which would barely be Xbox One level in docked mode.
still with 8 RT and 32 Tensor cores, but those tensor cores would have to work overtime to get a good 4k image out of the system while docked. but that one would have the advantage of maybe not even needing much of a downclock in handheld mode, as its max power draw is only 15 watts. so handheld mode would still be pretty impressive
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tkscz
Member
Honestly, I'd guess it'll probably be a little above that, somewhere between the PS4 and the Pro in terms of raw numbers and better than the Pro in terms of capability thanks to newer architecture.
And yeah, you're completely correct, it may not be anywhere near PS5 levels but Nintendo working in the realms of PS4 Pro would be amazing. Look at what they could do with hardware from 2014.
Pikmin 4 looks amazing and people need to stop forgetting the lighting and detail in Luigi's Mansion 3.
Fools idol
Banned
can someone explain why they never make powerful systems? I don't understand.
aliadiere25
Member
I have no problem with this because Nintendo produces good games.
aliadiere25
Member
I guess to make it more affordable so they can sell more. They can get away with it because they have a great library of games.
01011001
Banned
their powerful systems all performed worse than their less powerful ones.
SNES performed worse than the NES,
the N64 and GameCube performed worse than the Wii.
their handhelds, all of which always had at least 1 more powerful competitor, all performed really well.
Mister Wolf
Member
Looking forward to seeing what Monolith Soft does with this system. The next Metroid Prime should be a launch title.
systemr123
Banned
Nintendo has a long history of releasing portables and since the latest generation is a smash hit it’s pretty easy to assume the next Nintendo will be hybrid portable again.
01011001
Banned
well, it all depends on which chip you think is most likely used.
there are basically 3 tiers of chips available to them. all of which have a full spec and a reduced spec variant.
so 6 possible configurations total.
the Orin AGX, the Orin NX, and the Orin Nano.
full spec variant of each is 5.32TF, 1.88TF, and 1.28TF respectively.
reduced spec variants are 3.36TF, 1.57TF, and 0.64TF respectively.
they all also have varying amounts of RT and Tensor Cores
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Fools idol
Banned
those consoles are a thousand years old though, the world has changed. Can only imagine how good their flagship franchises would look on high fps and visual quality :-(
01011001
Banned
well they also now want to have a singular system. which will limit them in the here and now
tkscz
Member
According to the old rumors (that looked to be true) about the Switch Pro, they would've used the AGX model that only has 1790 CUDA cores, but with 16GBs of RAM. If it used the same clocks as the original switch it would do 1.2TF handheld and 2.8TF docked.
Of course we don't know if the successor will use Orin or wait on Thor, which Nvidia already has close to production. If those rumors from earlier this month were to be believed, they were waiting on Tegra Atlan (die shrunk Ampere) but because of Samsung's bad yields with 8nm Ampere, Nvidia broke their contract with them and can'd the 5nm Ampere+. While I see Nintendo probably going back to Orin, Thor being 4nm would be best for battery life and heat. Could run at higher clocks without using a lot of power and be put in a smaller form factor than what we see with the Steam Deck and ROG.
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01011001
Banned
honestly I will be so disappointed if they reduce docked clock speeds yet again
it was nonsense for the original Switch and would be nonsenae again here.so whichever chip they use, I hope they crank it to the maximum stable speed in docked mode. worst case scenario would be still below Series S levels of power draw and most likely easy to cool.
BlackTron
Member
Nintendo simply does not need high grade hardware to sell games. They just make the best system they can with cheap parts of the day and that's all they need to do. Mostly because their software guys are aliens and they have the most careful IP management on the planet.
We were lucky when cheap parts meant "you get a portable and home console in one unit that beats a 360". Now it means the aliens at Nintendo EAD get better than a PS4 to work on so we should be cheering.
tkscz
Member
Besides cooling, Nintendo has been power cautious since the Gamecube. I believe it's a Japanese thing but I still remember the WiiU being underclocked as well to meet a 15w power draw for Japanese homes.honestly I will be so disappointed if they reduce docked clock speeds yet again
so whichever chip they use, I hope they crank it to the maximum stable speed in docked mode. worst case scenario would be still below Series S levels of power draw and most likely easy to cool.
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
Not sure that's true, the gamecube went up against PS2 and the original Xbox and wasn't underpowered, it certainly got better versions of multiplatform games versus PS2.
I think it was the Wii when they threw power out the window.
BootsLoader
Banned
Can't wait for the FP32, secret nvidia sauce etc. threads that say "it theoretically perform near PS5, Series consoles".
tkscz
Member
You're right, the GC used 48watts compared to the Wii's 14.
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
Lol at anyone mentioning Series S in this thread unless they're saying "Anyone thinking Nintendo are releasing a portable system that can run games as well as Series S is living in a dreamworld."
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
I think I've misinterpreted "power" here to mean "graphical fidelity" rather than electricity draw.
Thank god my statement still works.
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