I played with fire.
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Final Fantasy XIV: Stormblood |OT| Y'all Need to Calm Down
- Thread starter Ken
- Start date
The reddit thread notes that the MCH dummy HP in the list is being misreported and that the actual value is slightly higher than bard. I haven't had functioning ACT in like three months but maybe I should figure it out.
Man if AST tossed out damage comparable to WHM and kept Balance the rioting would be amazing.
Each job gets its own dummy for each encounter supposedly designed around how the jobs are expected to perform.
Monk is pretty boned at this point; DRG might be able to make half a case with Disembowel still, but given everyone having Goad and MP goad now, I'm not sure physical ranged will have a set spot anymore which in turn will hurt DRG.
Man if AST tossed out damage comparable to WHM and kept Balance the rioting would be amazing.
Each job gets its own dummy for each encounter supposedly designed around how the jobs are expected to perform.
Monk is pretty boned at this point; DRG might be able to make half a case with Disembowel still, but given everyone having Goad and MP goad now, I'm not sure physical ranged will have a set spot anymore which in turn will hurt DRG.
Thank you, so it's not evidence that MCH is weak, but more that the game doesn't expect MCH to be strong. I'm fine with this.
Dunno... she wants to help with the revolution? I get why she wants to tag along but, where I am (Azim Steppe), you've got:
Badass samurai Roe who was apparently leader of the revolution and one of the best samurai in the land.
You've got badass ninja lady who is leader of the current resistance.
Hien is the rightful heir to the crown of Doma (and totally hot)
Elf woman... well she is borderline too​ but she's seen a lot of action in Coil and her grandfather was one of the most powerful mages in the land so fair enough
Then you've got... fake Yda.
You've got badass ninja lady who is leader of the current resistance.
Hien is the rightful heir to the crown of Doma (and totally hot)
Elf woman... well she is borderline too​ but she's seen a lot of action in Coil and her grandfather was one of the most powerful mages in the land so fair enough
Then you've got... fake Yda.
I'm not skipping but it's highly possible I missed something... did I miss something?
Worth noting both MNK and DRG have buddy system mechanics they can't access in an SSS situation.
That is an absolutely depressing WAR (and DRK) number. Hell, DRK's is kind of bonus sad since it's not even factoring TBN use and that's a small loss per. Still, SSS being SSS. Even Zurvan's dummy back in the day was basically tanks at the bottom of the pile, along with the mishaps with the A12S dummy, that it's kind of hard to take anything from their HP/DPS requirements besides where the bar is
I still dislike Alphinaud but Alisaie's ability to always start a quest with wildlife murdered near her has made her more endearing. Or maybe terrifying.
exactly the way I like it.
There's a bit here that will bug me since it does seem like it'll be Rhalgr's Reach but
.
That is an absolutely depressing WAR (and DRK) number. Hell, DRK's is kind of bonus sad since it's not even factoring TBN use and that's a small loss per. Still, SSS being SSS. Even Zurvan's dummy back in the day was basically tanks at the bottom of the pile, along with the mishaps with the A12S dummy, that it's kind of hard to take anything from their HP/DPS requirements besides where the bar is
and how many people will never actually do any SSS dummies
I still dislike Alphinaud but Alisaie's ability to always start a quest with wildlife murdered near her has made her more endearing. Or maybe terrifying.
exactly the way I like it.
There's a bit here that will bug me since it does seem like it'll be Rhalgr's Reach but
this will make for a rather odd disconnect as part of the story? Bad things happen at Rhalgr's Reach early on and unless they've vastly improved their instancing tech somehow, later players will see a healthier looking Rhalgr's Reach, and notably one with hundreds of players idling about, that doesn't quite match the events of the story. I'm hoping they have improved instancing when that time comes, or maybe they just plan to add low-key improvements so it still works as a fairly run down place
Spooky. The SMN numbers make me cautious since one fuck up for them is so punishing.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
I mean, Isn't obvious that SAM is gonna perform better when isolated?
The recent set of numbers are minimum expectations, which does mean it's just the game's expectations. The numbers a page or two back were actual effective damage which did indeed indicate MCH is weak. How much that part matters will be relative to the content they create, but it's currently far worse at what it does than Bard.
In honor of TBT, a reminder of how this was handled the first time:
This was eventually followed by an embarrassing amount of buffs; I dunno if the dev team is just bad at other jobs or if the players never worked out their secret optimal MCH rotation, but we've seen instances before of the expectations they have for the job not lining up with reality.
I'm a sad Summoner since 4.0. I feel as though the essence of the class (DOT management, timing, reacting in the moment) has all been diminished because they dumbed everything down and even took away Sustain, the one consistent way we keep our pets alive. And because old habits die hard, fucking up aetherflow and DWT has been VERY easy to do, and I'm just bummed this was their solution to our high DPS.
I think I may just end up taking Samurai through SB. I'd rather honestly level a different class than level SMN anymore with it playing like this. What the hell SE =/
Wouldn't it be the
Doman resistance base
It has a bunch of closed doors that go nowhere and an Aetheryte that needs fixing
I don't think anyone is particularly surprised at SAM doing well in non-party situations but so much as the gap they actually do have over other DPS currently (in actual values, not SSS value).
Yeah, I haven't mained SMN in awhile but Bahamut-egi allure was a pretty big "Man, do I still alt SMN?" moment. But then the details and starting to poke around initial rotational things and all the new SMN clunk back in the media tour time made me question that. And then it hit and was that clunky mess it looked like it would be. I'm glad the job seems to be performing really well in real world testing but damn if the process of the whole job doesn't seem unfun now.
I feel the same. The RNG Ruin spam makes me feel like the class identity I really loved in HW has been admonished. I like the QoL life stuff regarding Aether stuff, but yeah the punishment for missing just one stack is so severe. Having to wait an entire minute for just one stack is a huge DPS loss.
Right, the joy of the job is gone. And that's a big deal for somebody whose only level 60 class is Summoner, because now I've spent $40 dollars on brand new content that I need to level up to or slog through with SMN. SCH are feeling the same, they just got disemboweled this update. DPS numbers be damned.
Totally agree on ruin spam Vitanimus. And hearing that using Ruin only gets more boring and RNG dependent just sucks. It's all they want us to do between aether stacks and DWT.
Stone Ocean
Member
Dragon Sight should be good as well since it should increase SAM's damage even further. If DRG falls out of grace what type of comp are we looking at here? SAM/NIN/RDM/SMN?
You won't as along as you've beaten floor 50. It will ask if you want to start at floor 1 or floor 51.
Anoregon
The flight plan I just filed with the agency list me, my men, Dr. Pavel here. But only one of you!
After you reset and start a new run, you will have the option to start at floor 51.
Seijuro
Member
Is fishing not a very good gathering class to make money in? I primarily do it because I'm obsessed with fishing mini games in RPGs, and while the mechanic itself is boring it has a large collection of fish that gets my collective itch scratched.
But I notice the main things selling are fish that deal with leves. I was hoping there would be a lot of new recipes that use them but everything I've caught for the most part has been selling slow, and most of the fish are unreasonbly priced for the effort it takes to get them, totally confused with these new items. Might as well start using my miner in the new area if I can't sell my fish.
But I notice the main things selling are fish that deal with leves. I was hoping there would be a lot of new recipes that use them but everything I've caught for the most part has been selling slow, and most of the fish are unreasonbly priced for the effort it takes to get them, totally confused with these new items. Might as well start using my miner in the new area if I can't sell my fish.
Crafting material prices are going to be weird right now since there are so few max-level crafters; fishing has generally been capable of making some money at endgame although usually not a windfall. The key is going to be which food and pots make use of fish this time around, as that's usually what drove the value of fish prices.
There's also desynthing some ARR fish into bikinis, a market that ebbs and flows pretty constantly.
I figure DRG gets 100-150 of rDPS value out of the new Disembowel provided the group brings physical ranged (it's worth less with a bard because DoTs, more with a MCH since they nuked Lead Shot); Litany and Dragon Sight on top of that will help further close the gap. Monk has Brotherhood, but that's about it.
I'm honestly not sure what The Meta will be this time; part is hesitance to buying in because I have to believe we're going to see a bunch of balance changes alongside Omega normal, and part is that I'm not sure how much work has been done on group synergy and buff syncing to figure out if it changes power rankings. Like, maybe some of the weaker-in-isolation stuff is better in practice because they can align themselves with Trick Attack or whatever better.
I think that comp makes a decent amount of sense, but I could also see in theory MNK and DRG fighting over a third melee slot if fight design allows it. Depends on how much spread out for AOE stuff there is and how bad resource starvation can get.
There's also desynthing some ARR fish into bikinis, a market that ebbs and flows pretty constantly.
I figure DRG gets 100-150 of rDPS value out of the new Disembowel provided the group brings physical ranged (it's worth less with a bard because DoTs, more with a MCH since they nuked Lead Shot); Litany and Dragon Sight on top of that will help further close the gap. Monk has Brotherhood, but that's about it.
I'm honestly not sure what The Meta will be this time; part is hesitance to buying in because I have to believe we're going to see a bunch of balance changes alongside Omega normal, and part is that I'm not sure how much work has been done on group synergy and buff syncing to figure out if it changes power rankings. Like, maybe some of the weaker-in-isolation stuff is better in practice because they can align themselves with Trick Attack or whatever better.
I think that comp makes a decent amount of sense, but I could also see in theory MNK and DRG fighting over a third melee slot if fight design allows it. Depends on how much spread out for AOE stuff there is and how bad resource starvation can get.
E_Darkness
Member
I finally got the Garo mount for 10 frontline wins. Now to never get the other 2...
Stone Ocean
Member
>Blaster intensifies
I don't see Refresh/Tactician being important unless fights get heavy AoE, yeah. I'm starting to think BRD might struggle a tad.
Relaxed Muscle
Member
Is definetly harder that most solo instances.
Edit: Is this finally the comeback melee deserved since 2.0? Fuck yeah.
Stone Ocean
Member
If anything it's a caster comeback after Creator
I don't know how to put this, but I think the mechanics or flow of the fight seems unstable. When I finally beat him it wasn't even close, I melted him didn't even have to kite, just turned on bloodbath and melted him, may have used third eye just to be safe. But before that I got melted by him pretty much.
I'm inclined to agree; my only reservation is really that the damage delta between "real DPS" and "support DPS" is so embarrassingly massive both in SSS terms and in initial parse terms that it seems like they're functioning under the assumption that there's still going to be a default party comp with a ranged slot. Either they think they're designing encounters to require it, or they overreached on trying to handle mobility complaints.
A comeback would require them to have been in a bad spot before; most of the Heavensward optimal stuff was 2-3 melee (IIRC that i190 A4S in Korea was triple melee/MCH.)
Relaxed Muscle
Member
theifofdreams
Member
Is ninja a viable melee class, or has it been pushed to the bottom? In ffxi I loved playing ninja tank and while I'm pretty sure that's not possible here, I really like the idea at least of the class.
Stone Ocean
Member
Everyone got more mobility so its really weird that ranged get singled out like this.
If they hadn't increased the WD on bows and guns, phys ranged would be meme jobs.
4.0 isn't 2.0, and what worked to make Bard super important back then is pretty much not a thing now. The utility they bring is worth less than ever before, because all DPS are capable of resource battery-ing and thusfar jobs have been much better at self-sustaining their resources outside of AOE situations anyway. 100% uptime is a thing, but all they've done is made it easier to obtain. It was perfectly possible with cast times as well via stance dancing and Feint. Melee generally gets catered to to provide 95+% uptime, it's just usually the ranged jobs responsible for a chunk of the catering. And the actual rDPS buffing stuff that used to be the domain of support jobs is being matched by the other higher-damage jobs.
Paying 2.0 penalties without 2.0 advantages is pretty junk.
I think if I went digging back through the thread to around the reveal of the death of cast times, I could find myself fretting over this looking likely to happen and predicting the excuses/justifications that would follow. The "but support!!" thing was bound to come back, even though the value of it is diminished.
There was a lot of salt during Creator for the meta evolving to BRD/MCH; this being the fallout isn't super surprising. Basically have to hope the community reaction is sufficient to get things buffed up a little; bare minimum Machinist shouldn't have to work twice as hard to still be vastly inferior.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
The instanced areas to relieve server issues as an idea kind of pisses me off. It's like the anti-thesis of a mmo. They give me a selection of 3 instances, one with 40ish people, another, with 50ish, and the last with 60. It's a mmo, I want to see all of these people running around adventuring. Have you seen the maps? They are huge.
Itchy//Tasty
Member
UPDATE: I'm finally in, after almost a week of no luck. Loving it so far, the maps are huge and there's lots of interesting enemies. I'll stop complaining about server issues now.
It made sense when the Fringes was ~1.1k people, at least on Leviathan.
It made a lot less sense when there were 8-15 people across three zones.
It makes even less sense that when grouped with someone, it sends them to a different shard every time.
It makes the least amount of sense when it kept sending them to the most populated one by default.
Yeah it does go against the whole point of the thing but it should be only temporary.
BossDarkseid
Member
I have my Dragoon atm - and I'm really enjoying it - but I'm looking for an alternate to switch things up at some point...I'd kinda like Ranged DPS (but no Bard)...is there anything with a similar-ish feel to Dragoon or is it a case of ymmv?
So i wanted to pick some brains about the state of SAM and whether or not right now it is " too good .
We had this discusion for a bit in our FC
The basic argument from the pro nerf side was basically :
SAM damage by itself is already huge
SAM as it is right now put in a raid setting and buffed by Balance,Arrow and Trick attack etc would make it's damage absolutely monstrous and therefore its dps should be lowered slightly to bring it more in line with the other melee classes .
What do you guys think?
Perso,nally i think SAM is right where it needs to be .
We had this discusion for a bit in our FC
The basic argument from the pro nerf side was basically :
SAM damage by itself is already huge
SAM as it is right now put in a raid setting and buffed by Balance,Arrow and Trick attack etc would make it's damage absolutely monstrous and therefore its dps should be lowered slightly to bring it more in line with the other melee classes .
What do you guys think?
Perso,nally i think SAM is right where it needs to be .
Yeah I can understand it on the first few days but now I'm running into empty zones and I'm only at the third one...
In all honestly I don't think sam needs nerfed. I do think that other jobs need buffs though.
Lunafreya Nox Fleuret
Member
Stormblood better knock it out of the park with savage and super savage. That's pretty much all there is now for difficulty since ex primals have been lowered to easy mode.
If it's like Heavensward, you won't see that ever again in a week or two.
I think the other melee need utility buffs and maybe a slight potency buff. For DRG at least, dragon sight would be awesome if it was a straight +10% buff that gave 5% to anyone within 6 yalms of the DRG. Or even if the range was just extended or made self target/nearest party member. I also really disagree with the piercing debuff nerf, and the very low dps of BRD/MCH.
Varjis
Member
As a former WoW player that quit shortly after Legion and tried ARR when it first relaunched, how difficult will it be for me to jump in? I'm looking at playing on my Pro and going controller + keyboard (for chat)
I'm currently reading through Lodestone to apprise myself of the mechanics.
I'm currently reading through Lodestone to apprise myself of the mechanics.
SuperStiltzkin
Member
I skipped all the cutscenes in ARR, so i don't know how he was back then. But I like Alphinaud in Heavensward and Stormblood so far. I guess i have a soft spot for him and Tataru because they're your fellow traveling companions when you all are on the run to Ishgard.
I can't really get a read on Alisaie's character so far though. Currently neutral since she hasn't had much to do with so many characters contending with screentime. I think Heavensward made a smart decision of cutting down the starting cast to just WoL, Alphinaud, and Tataru. Stormblood on the otherhand starts with a huge returning cast. I'm still enjoying the story, but the set up isn't as strong for me.