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[Kermit The Frog]

I think US and uk sales are <2.4 million for the first week.

That 10 million shipped seems slightly optimistic for 2011.

Only slightly?! Try massively. They sold less than 2 million in their biggest market in their biggest month. The game is going to see a massive drop in the rest of the year and there is no way Europe or Japan(lol) are going to make up the deficit.

On that note, didn't EA say BF3 sold 5 million to consumers? I find that hard to believe since I doubt the game did ~3 million in Europe and the rest of the world.

That's what skews the perception somewhat - such preferences are a subjective thing. Most people clearly prefer their Halos, Gears and Fables to Sony's first party games, at least in the US. Sony does pump out a lot of games that are often perceived as great on GAF and some other corners of the internet, but their review scores and sales performances indicate that they're merely solid. Would money spent on Ratchets, Motorstorms, Killzones and Resistances have been better spent elsewhere? Not if you're a fan of those franchises, obviously, but from the business perspective?

Because when it comes down to it, for all its plentiful first party output, Sony has approximately as many standout franchises as Microsoft (I'm talking about this generation), but Microsoft has two huge shooters - a genre that's been very popular for a long time, especially in the US - and a couple of very successful motion controlled games, while Sony has none. It's not hard to see that the "but look at all the Sony's games!" argument does not hold up for many people.

I doubt Sony will bother with Ratchet or Resistance any longer so that leaves an opportunity for them to try new IPs that will actually sell well this time around. Also I wouldn't consider games like Ratchet or Resistance as being well recieved anywhee, internet or not, at least compared to games like Uncharted, GOW or KZ.

 

[bigtroyjon]

Only slightly?! Try massively. They sold less than 2 million in their biggest market in their biggest month. The game is going to see a massive drop in the rest of the year and there is no way Europe or Japan(lol) are going to make up the deficit.

On that note, didn't EA say BF3 sold 5 million to consumers? I find that hard to believe since I doubt the game did ~3 million in Europe and the rest of the world.

Download sales.

 

[French]

And to think that the PS3 is outselling the 360 worldwide even with average sales in the US.

 

[ThisWreckage]

That's what skews the perception somewhat - such preferences are a subjective thing. Most people clearly prefer their Halos, Gears and Fables to Sony's first party games, at least in the US. Sony does pump out a lot of games that are often perceived as great on GAF and some other corners of the internet, but their review scores and sales performances indicate that they're merely solid. Would money spent on Ratchets, Motorstorms, Killzones and Resistances have been better spent elsewhere? Not if you're a fan of those franchises, obviously, but from the business perspective?

Because when it comes down to it, for all its plentiful first party output, Sony has approximately as many standout franchises as Microsoft (I'm talking about this generation), but Microsoft has two huge shooters - a genre that's been very popular for a long time, especially in the US - and a couple of very successful motion controlled games, while Sony has none. It's not hard to see that the "but look at all the Sony's games!" argument does not hold up for many people.

I recall reading that Sony's games are reviewed the highest when it comes to first party offerings. Sony simply bet on the wrong horse. If they would have handed Insomniac or Sucker Punch Syphon Filter I think that would have been a much better decision than allowing Insomniac to make three Resistance games.

 

[Mpl90]

So, Skylanders is doing very well, and it seems it could explode this Christmas. In this case, it could help a LOT the Wii during the Holidays.

 

[mujun]

And to think that the PS3 is outselling the 360 worldwide even with average sales in the US.

Gotta be creative in an NPD thread if you want to fight the good fight using 360 vs PS3 sales figures

 

[Alx]

I recall reading that Sony's games are reviewed the highest when it comes to first party offerings. Sony simply bet on the wrong horse. If they would have handed Insomniac or Sucker Punch Syphon Filter I think that would have been a much better decision than allowing Insomniac to make three Resistance games.

I don't think first party games matter much after the first few years of a console (for MS and Sony anyway, things may be different for Nintendo). Since what most people really want are third party games (Madden/FIFA, COD and such), what matters most is the price, and the installed base of each console (for brand awareness, and multiplayer reasons). That's why having a headstart was so important for Microsoft.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

I recall reading that Sony's games are reviewed the highest when it comes to first party offerings.

That might have been the case at the time, but motion controlled games have brought their average quite a bit (for Microsoft, too, but not as much). I was curious myself so I checked. Going by Metacritic, Sony's retail PS3 games (whopping 70 titles!) are currently at 74.61, while Microsoft's retail Xbox 360 games (46 of them) stand at 76.91. I didn't check for Nintendo since there are many region-specific and co-published releases so I got lost.

But that's beside the point, general gaming public doesn't care about average scores or even the amount of solid releases, they primarily care about standout titles because that's what makes them desire a certain console (when it comes to software, at least).

 

[test_account]

No shit!

Heh, while that in itself is quite obvious of course, i didnt exactly mean it like that I just ment to say that if people are more interested in the Xbox 360 over a PS3, then it make sense why the Xbox 360 sells more despite the PS3 pricedrop. Price isnt always everything, and the Xbox 360 4GB model is still cheaper than the PS3 as well.

 

[TheOddOne]

I doubt Sony will bother with Ratchet or Resistance any longer so that leaves an opportunity for them to try new IPs that will actually sell well this time around. Also I wouldn't consider games like Ratchet or Resistance as being well recieved anywhee, internet or not, at least compared to games like Uncharted, GOW or KZ.

As much as people think those franchises won't go futher, they will. Expecially when a new console comes around, those will be perfect launch titles.

 

[Barrett2]

The disparity in hardware sales between PS3 & 360 is wild. 14% YOY increase vs 5% decrease? Damn.

 

[Deadly Joker]

Amazing sales for 360, it is still going strong without a price drop, they must be doing something very right


This year they only had Gears and Forza so far and sell unbelievably well

Next year they have far more big name games

Witcher 2
Skyrim timed exclusive DLC Expansions
Mass Effect 3 Kinect version
Halo 4
a new Alan Wake
a new Fable
Ryse from Crytek
Draco from Panzer Dragoon team

and a super collection of XBLA games, i see sales going far stronger in 2012

Lol, this is Lab Warrior from Gametrailers forums. He always has these list.

 

[Sapphire Dreams]

Can't wait to see what numbers COD will brake this month.

Also, Well Done Arkham City !

 

[get2sammyb]

I suppose it doesn't matter because Sony has an extremely bad name in the U.S. When I went to the Skyrim midnight release almost everyone was buying the 360 version. My friend was openly mocked for picking up the PS3 version.

That sure sounds mature.

 

[I'm an expert]

Why is this NPD thread completely dead..usually bringing down the site or sumtin..

 

[CrunchinJelly]

As much as people think those franchises won't go futher, they will. Expecially when a new console comes around, those will be perfect launch titles.

Errrr, no. Sony typically refresh their franchises every gen.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

Why is this NPD thread completely dead..usually bringing down the site or sumtin..

This happened on a Friday versus the traditional Thursday, the modern era of NPD on GAF has sucked compared to the glory days of Sales-Age, and X360 beating the pants off of its competition is now an old trend that leads to roughly predictable placements. As well, there's just not too much that's surprising this month as evidenced by Ninty and Sony Sales-Agers not hollering about anything in particular. I mean, look at that pathetic Sony PR.

 

[TheOddOne]

Errrr, no. Sony typically refresh their franchises every gen.

It's been a very different gen since the last one's, but with both those engines and franchises already established they will continue. There will be a new Uncharted, inFamous, Littlebigplanet and more stable Sony franchises of this gen. Trust me, most of them have already been greenlighted.

 

[get2sammyb]

I must admit the Sony situation in North America is a bit baffling. I don't think those numbers are terrible -- and I think they will pick up next month -- but I just don't get it. Some people in this thread seem to think the answer is to ditch existing exclusive games and focus on one "mega franchise" but, eurgh, I don't know. Do you really realise what you're saying?

Pretty much all Sony's exclusive games are of a high quality. The system is of a high quality. The brand is good.

I really don't think there's anything they can do until next generation. They just need to keep chugging along, stay within touching distance, and count on other markets to make up for the slack.

Which we know they do.

I don't think it's as doom as gloom as it seems, I just think the system should be doing better in North America. Right? I think we're all in agreement with that.

It's an odd one.

 

[Risk Breaker]

LOL Gears :/

 

[Averon]

LOL Gears :/

Yeah. Gears dropped pretty far from last month. Very front loaded, it seems.
55k for Rage combined doesn't sound all that impressive.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

I must admit the Sony situation in North America is a bit baffling. I don't think those numbers are terrible -- and I think they will pick up next month -- but I just don't get it. Some people in this thread seem to think the answer is to ditch existing exclusive games and focus on one "mega franchise" but, eurgh, I don't know. Do you really realise what you're saying?

Pretty much all Sony's exclusive games are of a high quality. The system is of a high quality. The brand is good.

I really don't think there's anything they can do until next generation. They just need to keep chugging along, stay within touching distance, and count on other markets to make up for the slack.

Which we know they do.

I don't think it's as doom as gloom as it seems, I just think the system should be doing better in North America. Right? I think we're all in agreement with that.

It's an odd one.

I don't believe that there's any justifiable sense of entitlement to greater success in NA that Sony deserves. X360 is simply the better, more appealing platform to people who live on this continent, as evidenced by sales numbers and the widening gap between them here. People can spend time typing up lists, drawing up charts of value proposition all day long and not be right.

 

[lowrider007]

The 360's head start really f'd the PS3 in the US, you set up an early foundation for a well integrated social gaming network and throw in a headset in every box it makes it hard for the competition to penetrate when your late to the party, especially when people have already set-up friends lists etc.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

The 360's head start really f'd the PS3 in the US, you set up an early foundation for a well integrated social gaming network and throw in a headset in every box it makes it hard for the competition to penetrate when your late to the party, especially when people have already set-up friends lists etc.

Right, that forward thinking set of decisions helped immensely, but would mean nothing in the end if MS hadn't continually been a good steward of their platform by always evolving it, even seven fucking years into its lifespan. Sony and Ninty need to learn this from MS if they want to be nimble enough to react to the competition and the market's desires.

 

[keit4]

Impressive 360 sales, as always, and good to see Dark Souls charting: Praise the sun! \o/

 

[get2sammyb]

I don't believe that there's any justifiable sense of entitlement to greater success in NA that Sony deserves. X360 is simply the better, more appealing platform to people who live on this continent, as evidenced by sales numbers and the widening gap between them here. People can spend time typing up lists, drawing up charts of value proposition all day long and not be right.

You misinterpret what I'm saying though. I'm not necessarily saying the XBOX 360 should be doing less, I'm saying the PS3 should be doing more.

I don't disagree with your points. The evidence clearly speaks. I just find it all a bit baffling. Because I'm sitting here, and I really can't think of many things Sony could do that would make a difference to its fortunes in North America.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

You misinterpret what I'm saying though. I'm not necessarily saying the XBOX 360 should be doing less, I'm saying the PS3 should be doing more.

I don't disagree with your points. The evidence clearly speaks. I just find it all a bit baffling. Because I'm sitting here, and I really can't think of many things Sony could do that would make a difference to its fortunes in North America.

I think you misunderstood my strangely-worded post, but I meant that Sony doesn't deserve any more success here while MS deserves theirs...and the North American market concurs. Anyway, it's late in the generation now and the current trends should continue mostly unchanged aside from big happenings on the timing of substantial price cuts. And Sony isn't likely to slash their PS3 even lower anytime soon just a couple of months after a $50 drop and still-poor corporation-wide financials. They created an overly expensive machine that didn't live up to its initial hype and certainly did not live up to its predecessors in reach and appeal thanks to it being so over-engineered. Simple as that.

 

[lowrider007]

Right, that forward thinking set of decisions helped immensely, but would mean nothing in the end if MS hadn't continually been a good steward of their platform by always evolving it, even seven fucking years into its lifespan. Sony and Ninty need to learn this from MS if they want to be nimble enough to react to the competition and the market's desires.

Well MS is a software power house in that regards, OS development is their forte, Sony and Ninty on the OS side of things have been embarrassing this gen, the Playstation's OS feels clunky and old now where as you say MS has keep their system feeling fresh always reinventing their front end, where Sony shot themselves in the foot is the lack of memory, it really didn't leave them much room to innovate and add important features like cross gamer chat etc.

 

[amdnv]

It doesn't include Steam.. but Steam isn't like 250k or something.. I mean most players online were like 25k when that game launched.

Except getting to 25k concurrent players on Steam requires about 250k sales.

 

[KingDizzi]

The 360's head start really f'd the PS3 in the US, you set up an early foundation for a well integrated social gaming network and throw in a headset in every box it makes it hard for the competition to penetrate when your late to the party, especially when people have already set-up friends lists etc.

MS is given way too much credit, they literally had to do nothing and just watch the PS3 burn with the infamous $599 price tag. Sony was fucked the day that price was announced, anyone whom thinks the outcome we have now would have been the same has PS3 released at the same price as the 360....well I don't want to make fun of the mentally challenged. That's just wrong. Sony just have to chalk this gen up to the 360, it's most simply the HD console of choice in NA. Since this is a NPD thread I'll leave it at that.

I see my darling (a racing sim) up there in the charts, any estimation as to how many Forza 4 has done? Would like some more numbers but looking at the charts Gears 3 looks to have dropped off like crazy. Rages not not deserve 550k for it was a shitty shitty little game.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

You misinterpret what I'm saying though. I'm not necessarily saying the XBOX 360 should be doing less, I'm saying the PS3 should be doing more.

But if you think PS3 should be doing more and Xbox 360 shouldn't be doing less, then PS3 would have to either eat into the sales of Nintendo's console - and it's not well equipped to wrestle away Wii's primary audience - or attract completely new people to gaming, which, again, it's not really capable of doing because it doesn't offer anything groundbreaking, and it can't ride the cheapest/best-Blu-ray-player-on-the-market train anymore either.

 

[Dreaver]

Really happy to see Dark Souls did well. Love the game!

Also well deserved for Microsoft that the X360 is still beasting. Awesome console. I love the controller, exclusives and online.

 

[lowrider007]

MS is given way too much credit, they literally had to do nothing and just watch the PS3 burn with the infamous $599 price tag. Sony was fucked the day that price was announced, anyone whom thinks the outcome we have now would have been the same has PS3 released at the same price as the 360....well I don't want to make fun of the mentally challenged. That's just wrong.

The pricing was just the icing on the cake, that is far from Sony's only mistake this gen, and I say that as an ardent Playstation fan, and to insinuate that people who think differently are mentally challenged is just plain childish.

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

Sony was fucked the day that price was announced, anyone whom thinks the outcome we have now would have been the same has PS3 released at the same price as the 360....

It's not the price tag that screwed PS3 over, it's Sony's arrogance and Kutaragi's over-ambition. The price tag was only the natural consequence, not the cause.

 

[get2sammyb]

But if you think PS3 should be doing more and Xbox 360 shouldn't be doing less, then PS3 would have to either eat into the sales of Nintendo's console - and it's not well equipped to wrestle away Wii's primary audience - or attract completely new people to gaming, which, again, it's not really capable of doing because it doesn't offer anything groundbreaking, and it can't ride the cheapest/best-Blu-ray-player-on-the-market train anymore either.

Well yes, I agree. I suppose that's the problem, for most people it's an "either/or" and in North America the defacto choice appears to be 360.

Hence why I don't really think there's anything Sony can do. Like I said before, it's going to just have to make do in North America, and bet on other territories.

It's not the price tag that screwed PS3 over, it's Sony's arrogance and Kutaragi's over-ambition. The price tag was only the natural consequence, not the cause.

Agreed. Thankfully the design principles for the Vita indicate that the PS4 will be a much more reasonable system.

I still think Sony are in a good position for next-gen, but that's a different discussion.

 

[KingDizzi]

The pricing was just the icing on the cake, that is far from Sony's only mistake this gen, and I say that as an ardent Playstation fan, and to insinuate that people who think differently are mentally challenged is just plain childish.

Right so read what I said, you in all seriousness think there would still be a gap of 11+ million between 360 and PS3 had the PS3 not released at $600? I would have thought what I said was pointing out the obvious yet here we are. :/

It's not the price tag that screwed PS3 over, it's Sony's arrogance and Kutaragi's over-ambition. The price tag was only the natural consequence, not the cause.

Crazy Ken was the cause of the $600, it was the result of Sony going the exotic route and not using off the shelf components. $600 is $600 though and Sony fucked over Sony this generation. I honestly don't know how this can be disputed.

 

[lowrider007]

Right so read what I said, you in all seriousness think there would still be a gap of 11+ million between 360 and PS3 had the PS3 not released at $600? I would have thought what I said was pointing out the obvious yet here we are. :/

The gap wouldn't be as big obviously but the 360 would still be ahead, that is pretty much a guarantee, price alone is not the reason why the PS3 isn't matching the 360 in sales.

 

[elrechazado]

Why is this NPD thread completely dead..usually bringing down the site or sumtin..

NPD threads have been dead a long time because there are no surprises anymore. 360 is now firmly in first place, wii keeps falling down, ps3 bringing up 2nd or 3rd. Nothing to fight over, no "just wait till _____ " posts from rabid sony fans, no wii gloaters, etc.

 

[P90]

The 360's head start really f'd the PS3 in the US, you set up an early foundation for a well integrated social gaming network and throw in a headset in every box it makes it hard for the competition to penetrate when your late to the party, especially when people have already set-up friends lists etc.

No, it was the $599 PS3 launch pricetag that was the fatal launch era.

 

[venne]

Right so read what I said, you in all seriousness think there would still be a gap of 11+ million between 360 and PS3 had the PS3 not released at $600? I would have thought what I said was pointing out the obvious yet here we are. :/



Crazy Ken was the cause of the $600, it was the result of Sony going the exotic route and not using off the shelf components. $600 is $600 though and Sony fucked over Sony this generation. I honestly don't know how this can be disputed.

Maybe, but we can't say that Microsoft wouldn't have reacted in turn. Sony's pricing gaffe allowed Microsoft to pretty much cruise this entire generation without adjusting their price. The top Xbox package retailed for $399 in 2005 and is still $399 in 2011. For a six year old electronic device, that's incredible. Microsoft should send them flowers on the anniversary of the $599 announcement.

 

[elrechazado]

No, it was the $599 PS3 launch pricetag that was the fatal launch era.

Late launch compared to the competition, repeated inferior third party inferior versions of games, poor online system for the first year or so, and many other problems were the fatal problem. Playing catchup for an entire gen when you were the runaway winner with the hands down best console the gen before is not good.

 

[Bitmap Frogs]

Praise the Sun!

I'm happy that Dark Souls charted, well deserved!

 

[REMEMBER CITADEL]

I still think Sony are in a good position for next-gen, but that's a different discussion.

I agree, the situation is far from dire, although their position is obviously nowhere near as good as it used to be coming into this generation. They can't afford another mistake, and that should keep them on their toes.

As for Vita, I'm not sure if it will fly, but that too is a topic for another discussion.

Crazy Ken was the cause of the $600, it was the result of Sony going the exotic route and not using off the shelf components.

Yes, and their desire to win the video format war. Honestly, I'm not sure if it will be worth it in the end since streaming seems to be becoming more and more prevalent.

Maybe, but we can't say that Microsoft wouldn't have reacted in turn. Sony's pricing gaffe allowed Microsoft to pretty much cruise this entire generation without adjusting their price.

I would somewhat agree, although it was far from being a cruise, and not only because of their own big mistake with RRoD. Sony left them an opening, yes, but Microsoft still had to do a lot of hard work themselves. Their third party software team especially did a tremendous job of leveling the playing field and wrestling away a number of important third party franchises from Sony, many coming from Japan. It was in part thanks to great efforts from the software development team which made the 360 such a pleasant platform to develop for, and that was in turn made possible by the hardware group's decisions and strides made on the online front, so it's all interconnected. Microsoft has set good foundations to seize the opportunity when it presents itself, and then they did just that.

 

[Luckyman]

Only slightly?! Try massively. They sold less than 2 million in their biggest market in their biggest month. The game is going to see a massive drop in the rest of the year and there is no way Europe or Japan(lol) are going to make up the deficit.

On that note, didn't EA say BF3 sold 5 million to consumers? I find that hard to believe since I doubt the game did ~3 million in Europe and the rest of the world.

Dude it was tracked for 5 days and did 2.1M. It will post massive numbers in November too. USA is not even close to 50% of the market for this game because of strong PC focus. They usually ship first month sales x2 so 10M is not at all overshipped.

 

[pixelbox]

I gotta hand it to MS, they really know their fanbase/culture. But i wonder if this has more to do with PS3 not being a platform for shooters. No doubt BF3 gave that extra boost. Yes for 8 months MS had the lead but this amount of lead in a month makes me curious. That coupled with word of mouth(friends with 360's encouraging friends to buy 360 plus game) seems to be at play. And then there's still the kinect and advertising...makes it less of a surprise. hm

 

[Monty Mole]

So, Skylanders is doing very well, and it seems it could explode this Christmas. In this case, it could help a LOT the Wii during the Holidays.

The 360 version is currently outselling the Wii version in the UK.

 

[RPGamer92]

MS should drop the 360 price to $200. The sales increase would be massive.

 

[intheinbetween]

I gotta hand it to MS, they really know their fanbase/culture. But i wonder if this has more to do with PS3 not being a platform for shooters. No doubt BF3 gave that extra boost. Yes for 8 months MS had the lead but this amount of lead in a month makes me curious. That coupled with word of mouth(friends with 360's encouraging friends to buy 360 plus game) seems to be at play. And then there's still the kinect and advertising...makes it less of a surprise. hm

are you implying 360 is a platform for shooters while PS3 is not? what's the difference between both to say that?

 

[RPGamer92]

are you implying 360 is a platform for shooters while PS3 is not? what's the difference between both to say that?

Online?...

 

[Graphics Horse]

NPD threads have been dead a long time because there are no surprises anymore. 360 is now firmly in first place, wii keeps falling down, ps3 bringing up 2nd or 3rd. Nothing to fight over, no "just wait till _____ " posts from rabid sony fans, no wii gloaters, etc.

Just wait til next gen!