Random aside, but Persona 5 has been pretty good about your friends actually talking to each other outside of of the protagonist's sphere of influence. Definitely a huge step up from 3 and 4.
I still think CS1 did a pretty good job with getting Class VII to interact with each other, but in retrospect, they could have definitely gone further with deeper interpersonal relationships that didn't involve Rean. I don't even think it was necessarily a "these girls had to be available to Rean" type situation; there were simply too many characters to juggle (unlike FC/SC where Estelle & Joshua could have meaningful interactions with tons of different characters)
The "has to be available to Rean" thing became very evident to me during the Thors Festival closing party when, instead of them interacting with each other, all of them (including the guys) are just standing by their lonesome, waiting for Rean to talk to them.
Just having party members involved in each other's Free Activities would alleviate this greatly. It would be simpler to do than Persona S.Link too, considering CS's are not date-agnostic and not based on affection points.
That's probably going to happen. Muse and Ash still aren't Class VII and probably won't both join the party until late-game since their Classes will be doing other things every other chapter. So Muse seems to join you in Ordis, Ash in another field study, and maybe both later + unannounced player characters. It seems no different from how Zero/Ao no Kiseki embellished the central four-person team.
That Ash-in-Red-Light artwork is great. Hopefully he doesn't disappoint.
Also, how come both characters get to have atmospheric scenery art all to themselves while the four initially-announced people don't? #ClassVIIDieEarly
The "has to be available to Rean" thing became very evident to me during the Thors Festival closing party when, instead of them interacting with each other, all of them (including the guys) are just standing by their lonesome, waiting for Rean to talk to them.
Just having party members involved in each other's Free Activities would alleviate this greatly. It would be simpler to do than Persona S.Link too, considering CS's are not date-agnostic and not based on affection points.
Even I couldn't defend that particular moment. It would have been great if CS did some more mixing and matching between Free Activities. I loved seeing Jusis appear in Machias's events, but it would have been better if we occasionally had these moments where Jusis would spend time gardening with Emma, or Gaius would train with Laura.
That's probably going to happen. Muse and Ash still aren't Class VII and probably won't both join the party until late-game since their Classes will be doing other things every other chapter. So Muse seems to join you in Ordis, Ash in another field study, and maybe both later + unannounced player characters. It seems no different from how Zero/Ao no Kiseki embellished the central four-person team.
Random aside, but Persona 5 has been pretty good about your friends actually talking to each other outside of of the protagonist's sphere of influence. Definitely a huge step up from 3 and 4.
I still think CS1 did a pretty good job with getting Class VII to interact with each other, but in retrospect, they could have definitely gone further with deeper interpersonal relationships that didn't involve Rean. I don't even think it was necessarily a "these girls had to be available to Rean" type situation; there were simply too many characters to juggle (unlike FC/SC where Estelle & Joshua could have meaningful interactions with tons of different characters)
Was really looking forward to a tight relationship between Rean and his 3 students. Ah well, I'm sure the new cast will be solid.
Yeah, Persona's doing a pretty god job, barring the social links. Banter actually exists between characters like Yusuke/Ryuji, Ryuji/Ann, Ann/Makoto, Morgana/Ryuji, etc. Really gets your OTP shipping sailing. That said, the social links as always are still too isolated from the rest of the game, though I hear a couple of them involve other characters which is pretty great.
On another note, seeing Milium making a comeback is nice. Now where's Jusis?
You can farm it by looking at turn bonusses and abusing that. However those skills are not typically available early in the game. I mean not on the level where you can control the flow of battle.
If you are still watching the thread, make sure to use Estelle S-craft on the ''Sepith'' turn order bonus, she pummels the monster multiple time resulting in a lot of Sepiths generation on those turns. And yeah focus on opening slots first.
The more I think about the epilogue of CS2 , the more annoyed I get at what a wasted opportunity CS3 is shaping up to be. I'm glad it'll finally feature the unseen western half of the empire but it really needed a shift in protagonist, particularly since (CS2 epilogue)
Rean became the antagonist in the occupation of Crossbell.
Worse still is the return to a school setting. With a series that's releases span 13 years, why do they think anyone following this story gives a fuck about pretending to be at school?
With the 3rd coming can someone who played tell me is the best weapon come from books ? I'll need to check if I can find a guide so that I don't miss them if so.
Is there any Trails in the Sky playthrough out there with good commentary? I kind of would love to watch one with someone or a couple of people that know the series well commenting along.
The more I think about the epilogue of CS2 , the more annoyed I get at what a wasted opportunity CS3 is shaping up to be. I'm glad it'll finally feature the unseen western half of the empire but it really needed a shift in protagonist, particularly since (CS2 epilogue)
Rean became the antagonist in the occupation of Crossbell.
Worse still is the return to a school setting. With a series that's releases span 13 years, why do they think anyone following this story gives a fuck about pretending to be at school?
Yea, I am not looking forward to the whole School-Mission-School structure again and am holding on to the hope that there'd be some kind of a plot swerve early.
The more I think about the epilogue of CS2 , the more annoyed I get at what a wasted opportunity CS3 is shaping up to be. I'm glad it'll finally feature the unseen western half of the empire but it really needed a shift in protagonist, particularly since (CS2 epilogue)
Rean became the antagonist in the occupation of Crossbell.
Worse still is the return to a school setting. With a series that's releases span 13 years, why do they think anyone following this story gives a fuck about pretending to be at school?
I feel that the Cold Steel games are very odd in the overall story of the series. I know it's supposed to be beginner-friendly games, but I feel they throw to much new things in this arc that (to my knowledge) weren't even hinted in previous games.
For example (CS2 Spoiler)
the existence of witches as another faction in the story. I don't remember this being hinted at in previous games or inside Erebonia. Before Emily tell us she's a witch, I thought she was a member of the church and there was no hint whatsoever to the possibility of existence of witches.
The robots was another thing that bothered me because of how fast engineering evolved in that world. You have mass production of robots and yet have researchers trying to understand orbal waves. In previous games, those robots were like creations of past civilizations with much more evolved technology and even Ouroboros couldn't mass produce them (Patel Matel was also very bulky design).
One last thing that also bothered me was the lack of a treasure from the goddess which was also a recurrent theme on past games.
Basically, my main complaints is that I don't think we have seen the details that tie CS along with some plot points seen in previous games on the series. It doesn't help that this whole arc feels (and is) padded along much more than needed.
I really hope that CS3 will answer a lot of things and that it will make the whole trilogy worthwhile.
With the 3rd coming can someone who played tell me is the best weapon come from books ? I'll need to check if I can find a guide so that I don't miss them if so.
No. You don't collect the books; they show up in the library you saw at the end of the livestream. Each chapter, new books will be added; nothing you haven't found in FC/SC before, though.
With the 3rd coming can someone who played tell me is the best weapon come from books ? I'll need to check if I can find a guide so that I don't miss them if so.
No. You don't collect the books; they show up in the library you saw at the end of the livestream. Each chapter, new books will be added; nothing you haven't found in FC/SC before, though.
There is, however, an accessory that comes from reading all the books in the library as soon as they show up, IIRC. I don't think I've ever successfully done it, though. It's not the only hidden reward in the game, too.
EDIT - adding in, in case anyone asks...
The two most well-known hidden prizes are... (3rd spoilers, obviously)
Heavenly Mirror - a special quartz that only appears if you have over 300 battles and did not run from a single fight. It becomes available at the final chapter. The character with it equipped loses 20% max HP and gains a 50% chance of reflecting any physical attack. The other is the Demonic Mirror - this quartz only appears if you have run away from over 300 battles. Same as Heavenly Mirror, it then becomes available at the final chapter, and the character loses 30% max EP and gains a 50% chance of reflecting any arts cast on him/her. If you get one of these on a playthrough, you can't get the other. So you can't get the Heavenly Mirror, then run from fights 300 times then get the other one.
These are both updated items from the PSP version- so the original PC version doesn't have them.
But there are other items littered throughout the game based on certain situations and conditions.
Yea, I am not looking forward to the whole School-Mission-School structure again and am holding on to the hope that there'd be some kind of a plot swerve early.
I feel that the Cold Steel games are very odd in the overall story of the series. I know it's supposed to be beginner-friendly games, but I feel they throw to much new things in this arc that (to my knowledge) weren't even hinted in previous games.
For example (CS2 Spoiler)
the existence of witches as another faction in the story. I don't remember this being hinted at in previous games or inside Erebonia. Before Emily tell us she's a witch, I thought she was a member of the church and there was no hint whatsoever to the possibility of existence of witches.
The robots was another thing that bothered me because of how fast engineering evolved in that world. You have mass production of robots and yet have researchers trying to understand orbal waves. In previous games, those robots were like creations of past civilizations with much more evolved technology and even Ouroboros couldn't mass produce them (Patel Matel was also very bulky design).
One last thing that also bothered me was the lack of a treasure from the goddess which was also a recurrent theme on past games.
Basically, my main complaints is that I don't think we have seen the details that tie CS along with some plot points seen in previous games on the series. It doesn't help that this whole arc feels (and is) padded along much more than needed.
I really hope that CS3 will answer a lot of things and that it will make the whole trilogy worthwhile.
The new faction you mention was rather odd, did they perhaps feature in the Crossbell games? I don't feel the addition of this faction was necessary or beneficial in any way but I'm trying to remain open minded since we still don't really know very much about them or how they might tie into other factions. Why the church didn't feature is beyond me but maybe they will in 3?
The tech leap bothered me less as I'm seem to recall it's mentioned in other games that people (
Ouroboros
?) have reverse engineered ancient technology from before the fall The scale on which they had managed it did seem a bit of a stretch perhaps.
I just played the first hour of FC again and I feel like people describing that beginning as slow aren't quite accurate. In certain ways I think it actually starts rather fast you can explore really quickly and connect to your town really fast. Trying to take small notes while playing this time but stuff like meeting a little girl(Claire) that ships Joshua and Estelle and wants to become a reporter at Liberls news, these little moments of succinct characterization that make the series really compelling you get to them really fast.
Comparing Persona 5 to that I'd say that game actually starts waaaaaaay slower.
The difference there really is just that it does start on a more "exciting" note but then really slows down. And this comparison isn't meant to be a dig(cause I love that game) it's just interesting to me that I think people associate their excitement level more strongly to how fast or slow a game is rather than the actual pace of gameplay.
Its rather that both make every step early on memorable and meaningful for world-building and larger-than-life events. Speed is risky for those, and too many games waste time making you stop and smell some very bland roses.
I just played the first hour of FC again and I feel like people describing that beginning as slow aren't quite accurate. In certain ways I think it actually starts rather fast you can explore really quickly and connect to your town really fast. Trying to take small notes while playing this time but stuff like meeting a little girl(Claire) that ships Joshua and Estelle and wants to become a reporter at Liberls news, these little moments of succinct characterization that make the series really compelling you get to them really fast.
Comparing Persona 5 to that I'd say that game actually starts waaaaaaay slower.
The difference there really is just that it does start on a more "exciting" note but then really slows down. And this comparison isn't meant to be a dig(cause I love that game) it's just interesting to me that I think people associate their excitement level more strongly to how fast or slow a game is rather than the actual pace of gameplay.
FINALLY... someone else who agrees with me that FC's start isn't that slow at all!
Not that speed really matters, but rather than tell other people that FC is slow, I wish people said that reading dialogue is what makes the game amazingly fun but consequently it can feel like things are moving at a slower pace because lots of reading is going on.
The new faction you mention was rather odd, did they perhaps feature in the Crossbell games? I don't feel the addition of this faction was necessary or beneficial in any way but I'm trying to remain open minded since we still don't really know very much about them or how they might tie into other factions. Why the church didn't feature is beyond me but maybe they will in 3?
The tech leap bothered me less as I'm seem to recall it's mentioned in other games that people (
Ouroboros
?) have reverse engineered ancient technology from before the fall The scale on which they had managed it did seem a bit of a stretch perhaps.
My japanese isn't perfect, but there was no mention of that faction in Crossbell as far as I know.
Another thing we don't know how it ties to CS is
the current Ouroboros plan. The first half of it would be in Crossbell while the second in Erebonia. And we still have absolutely no idea of what that is in Erebonia. (Unless it's written on those black records that I didn't read)
FINALLY... someone else who agrees with me that FC's start isn't that slow at all!
Not that speed really matters, but rather than tell other people that FC is slow, I wish people said that reading dialogue is what makes the game amazingly fun but consequently it can feel like things are moving at a slower pace because lots of reading is going on.
I was a bit surprised by it myself but from a pure gameplay point of view the game opens up super fast. It's like not even 5 minutes before you can step into Rolent and talk to town folks and maybe another 5min to go to the test side and fight. I definitely was guilty too of mixing up immediate excitement/story escalation with actual game pace and was swept up by people bringing up the slowness constantly.
After that it's really just the bracer life. I think some people yearn too much for high story escalation which doesn't really happen until waaaay late and just slowly creeps up on you. But I feel like that's more on people wanting this to be a different type of story than an actual flaw of it's story telling.
Cause I still remember very much being into the bracer life. It kind of mirrored some of the best parts of Persona 4 where it's you learning about the Japanese rural town life. Dunno I just really appreciate living the slightly mundane but still generally rather active life of a bracer
until the game goes nation wide crisis crazy with the attempted coup at the end.
After that it's really just the bracer life. I think some people yearn too much for high story escalation which doesn't really happen until waaaay late and just slowly creeps up on you. But I feel like that's more on people wanting this to be a different type of story than an actual flaw of it's story telling.
This is exactly why it's "slow." It's not bombastic and it takes a while for any drama to start unfolding, so for some people they aren't going to get hooked and find it boring.
That, and the fact a lot of the early game can feel irrelevant and disconnected, even though it's building up for bigger things. This is something that happened to me, I appreciated FC's story significantly more on the second playthrough and actually prefer it to SC (which I've only played once to FC's twice, but I don't think a replay will change my feelings on some of its issues).
I feel that the Cold Steel games are very odd in the overall story of the series. I know it's supposed to be beginner-friendly games, but I feel they throw to much new things in this arc that (to my knowledge) weren't even hinted in previous games.
For example (CS2 Spoiler)
the existence of witches as another faction in the story. I don't remember this being hinted at in previous games or inside Erebonia. Before Emily tell us she's a witch, I thought she was a member of the church and there was no hint whatsoever to the possibility of existence of witches.
The robots was another thing that bothered me because of how fast engineering evolved in that world. You have mass production of robots and yet have researchers trying to understand orbal waves. In previous games, those robots were like creations of past civilizations with much more evolved technology and even Ouroboros couldn't mass produce them (Patel Matel was also very bulky design).
One last thing that also bothered me was the lack of a treasure from the goddess which was also a recurrent theme on past games.
Basically, my main complaints is that I don't think we have seen the details that tie CS along with some plot points seen in previous games on the series. It doesn't help that this whole arc feels (and is) padded along much more than needed.
I really hope that CS3 will answer a lot of things and that it will make the whole trilogy worthwhile.
The three 'examples' you mentioned happen to be intertwined (CS2 spoilers):
Witches have not been mentioned before Cold Steel because they weren't relevant for the story -- the witches exist to keep the Sept-Terrion of Fire concealed. If you know how to conceal something, you also know how to reveal something -- which is the inside knowledge Vita possesses and probably the reason she was invited to join Ouroboros in the first place. Witches are one half of this system of concealment, gnomes the other half -- gnomes also created the Divine Knights and the Spirit Temples throughout the world. Each Divine Knight is a 'fragment' of the 'Great One's' (probably the Sept-Terrion) power.
Cold Steel is hardly unique in introducing new stuff -- just look at all the stuff Ao throws at you.
This is exactly why it's "slow." It's not bombastic and it takes a while for any drama to start unfolding, so for some people they aren't going to get hooked and find it boring.
That, and the fact a lot of the early game can feel irrelevant and disconnected, even though it's building up for bigger things. This is something that happened to me, I appreciated FC's story significantly more on the second playthrough and actually prefer it to SC (which I've only played once to FC's twice, but I don't think a replay will change my feelings on some of its issues).
I just played the first hour of FC again and I feel like people describing that beginning as slow aren't quite accurate. In certain ways I think it actually starts rather fast you can explore really quickly and connect to your town really fast. Trying to take small notes while playing this time but stuff like meeting a little girl(Claire) that ships Joshua and Estelle and wants to become a reporter at Liberls news, these little moments of succinct characterization that make the series really compelling you get to them really fast.
Comparing Persona 5 to that I'd say that game actually starts waaaaaaay slower.
The difference there really is just that it does start on a more "exciting" note but then really slows down. And this comparison isn't meant to be a dig(cause I love that game) it's just interesting to me that I think people associate their excitement level more strongly to how fast or slow a game is rather than the actual pace of gameplay.
I don't think there's much point in comparing FC with Persona 5, but if we want to talk about pace I think we can break it down into two things - narrative progression and player agency. It's true that Persona 5 slows down a lot in narrative progression, while FC keeps a steady pace throughout with something always happening. But the difference I feel is that FC is a much more passive story overall, with the leads (and as a result the player's viewpoint) being that of observers getting involved in stuff which doesn't always directly affect them, and the party members always feeling like guests up until the end. On the other hand, Persona 5 has tons of agency, with each part of the story feeling like do or die. It also introduces party members in ways where they feel significant and join your group for good.
FC was infinitely better on my second playthrough, but that was probably mainly because I approached it with a completely different attitude and expectations. SC I conversely liked much less on my second playthrough, and it went from okay to "yeah not feeling it at all". It's weird.
The three 'examples' you mentioned happen to be intertwined (CS2 spoilers):
Witches have not been mentioned before Cold Steel because they weren't relevant for the story -- the witches exist to keep the Sept-Terrion of Fire concealed. If you know how to conceal something, you also know how to reveal something -- which is the inside knowledge Vita possesses and probably the reason she was invited to join Ouroboros in the first place. Witches are one half of this system of concealment, gnomes the other half -- gnomes also created the Divine Knights and the Spirit Temples throughout the world. Each Divine Knight is a 'fragment' of the 'Great One's' (probably the Sept-Terrion) power.
Cold Steel is hardly unique in introducing new stuff -- just look at all the stuff Ao throws at you.
I was waiting for you to answer since you're a walking bible about everything Trails.
My only question about your answers is that where do they reveal this in game ? The black records ?
Ao also does this of throwing a lot at you too, but I felt more overwhelmed in CS. This might be because my english is much better than my japanese so the amount of information could greatly differ.
Still find it weird I'm looking forward to this more than I was looking forward to SC. I guess part of it was that SC was consistently promised and always there despite how long it took, so once it came out it was more of a "finally."
This one came out of nowhere and is a game I doubted I was ever going to play at all, and the realization that 1) it's actually happening, and 2) it's close didn't really hit until the Twitch stream.
|OT| Fish of the North Star
|OT| Eat your graham crackers, Kevin
|OT| Please buy this game so we can get Crossbell
|OT| Ziggy Stardoors and the Stregas from Maybelle
|OT| Silver Will, Golden Wings, Platinum Stars
Trails in the Sky the 3rd |OT| Time's the charm
Trails in the Sky the 3rd |OT| Trails in your Backlog.
Trails in the Sky the 3rd |OT| The Wild adventures of Priest and Nun.
