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[Smiling Bandit]

And by the way I'll let you in on a little secret: Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe. These companies never do, they are not idiots. PS3 is not "high tech", it's a ****ing mass-produced consumer product. Blu Ray is not as expensive as they want to make you believe. It's the next ****ing iteration of a laser disc storage system, again mass produced consumer cheapware. The only high tech you get is in form of PR statements from the corporations. Guess why these products are so expensive at the beginning of the cycle? Huh? Yeah.

So with this little reality check the PS3 will do fine. They propably won't be market leader but they'll play their N64 or maybe only Xbox role, be profitable to Sony and present us with some nice games, leading into the PS4 generation. No plug pulling or any of this complete out of question bollocks.
It's always with the extrems on this site. Either a company is undisputed, unchallengable market leader or they have to chancel all their products and become some kind of bottom scraper.

 

[justjohn]

Read my previous posts. I'm not even advocating for them to actually, officially drop it.

Here is what I think will be happening in a year:

1) The hardware will stop being subsidized (which in effect means almost complete abandonment of US and Japan);

2) Dramatic reduction of fist party effort on PS3 and shift to PS@ and PSP.

3) Repeated declarations by all Sony managment brass that they are 100% commited to PS3.

This is what I called pulling the plug. It makes little sense for them to actually declare anything officially. So I do not expect an official announcement.

jesus christ you are an idiot. so all those games they've been showing at gamers day, plus games like ffxiii and vs xiii which SE have spent millions already developing, whats going to happen to them?
oh right ported to the wii. i like the way you pretend to care about sony's business to mask your perveted sony doom and gloom fantasies.

 

[AniHawk]

i like the way you pretend to care about sony's business to mask your perveted sony doom and gloom fantasies.

You do? I find it annoying, myself.

 

[Ronok]

And by the way I'll let you in on a little secret: Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe. These companies never do, they are not idiots. PS3 is not "high tech", it's a ****ing mass-produced consumer product. Blu Ray is not as expensive as they want to make you believe. It's the next ****ing iteration of a laser disc storage system, again mass produced consumer cheapware. The only high tech you get is in form of PR statements from the corporations. Guess why these products are so expensive at the beginning of the cycle? Huh? Yeah.

So with this little reality check the PS3 will do fine. They propably won't be market leader but they'll play their N64 or maybe only Xbox role, be profitable to Sony and present us with some nice games, leading into the PS4 generation. No plug pulling or any of this complete out of question bollocks.
It's always with the extrems on this site. Either a company is undisputed, unchallengable market leader or they have to chancel all their products and become some kind of bottom scraper.

Wow...... :-/

 

[Fuzzy]

Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe.

Sony financial reports are outside sources now?

 

[justjohn]

btw didnt the main component in the ps3 which is also the most expensive, recently tumble down in price? i dont even think they're losing as much money as previously thought.

 

[Phife Dawg]

And by the way I'll let you in on a little secret: Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe. These companies never do, they are not idiots. PS3 is not "high tech", it's a ****ing mass-produced consumer product. Blu Ray is not as expensive as they want to make you believe. It's the next ****ing iteration of a laser disc storage system, again mass produced consumer cheapware. The only high tech you get is in form of PR statements from the corporations. Guess why these products are so expensive at the beginning of the cycle? Huh? Yeah.

So with this little reality check the PS3 will do fine. They propably won't be market leader but they'll play their N64 or maybe only Xbox role, be profitable to Sony and present us with some nice games, leading into the PS4 generation. No plug pulling or any of this complete out of question bollocks.
It's always with the extrems on this site. Either a company is undisputed, unchallengable market leader or they have to chancel all their products and become some kind of bottom scraper.

While I agree that PS3 won't fail like some hope it will I'm rather interested in your little secret. Don't tell me it's the guesstimates that are flowing around the web.

Sony reported quite a big loss for the fourth quarter of the fiscal year and it's mainly due to PS3. After all that is the business model: Sell the hardware at a loss and make up for it through software sales and royalties.

So I'd really love to see the source of your little secret.

 

[titiklabingapat]

We're talking about sales, at the very least.

 

[Innotech]

Financially, Sony is in deep, deep shit and theres really no sugarcoating that.

 

[MrPonx]

less than a year ago who would've imagined that Sony fans would be satisfied by comparing them to GC's level of "success" ...

tables have officially been turned, and it will take a lot of time and effort to turn back, if ever.

 

[Innotech]

less than a year ago who would've imagined that Sony fans would be satisfied by comparing them to GC's level of "success" ...

tables have officially been turned, and it will take a lot of time and effort to turn back, if ever.

I think thats what nintendos "revolution" was all about :lol

 

[_Alkaline_]

And by the way I'll let you in on a little secret: Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe. These companies never do, they are not idiots. PS3 is not "high tech", it's a ****ing mass-produced consumer product. Blu Ray is not as expensive as they want to make you believe. It's the next ****ing iteration of a laser disc storage system, again mass produced consumer cheapware. The only high tech you get is in form of PR statements from the corporations. Guess why these products are so expensive at the beginning of the cycle? Huh? Yeah.

So with this little reality check the PS3 will do fine. They propably won't be market leader but they'll play their N64 or maybe only Xbox role, be profitable to Sony and present us with some nice games, leading into the PS4 generation. No plug pulling or any of this complete out of question bollocks.
It's always with the extrems on this site. Either a company is undisputed, unchallengable market leader or they have to chancel all their products and become some kind of bottom scraper.

Why hello there.

 

[Stop It]

And by the way I'll let you in on a little secret: Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe. These companies never do, they are not idiots. PS3 is not "high tech", it's a ****ing mass-produced consumer product. Blu Ray is not as expensive as they want to make you believe. It's the next ****ing iteration of a laser disc storage system, again mass produced consumer cheapware. The only high tech you get is in form of PR statements from the corporations. Guess why these products are so expensive at the beginning of the cycle? Huh? Yeah.

So with this little reality check the PS3 will do fine. They propably won't be market leader but they'll play their N64 or maybe only Xbox role, be profitable to Sony and present us with some nice games, leading into the PS4 generation. No plug pulling or any of this complete out of question bollocks.
It's always with the extrems on this site. Either a company is undisputed, unchallengable market leader or they have to chancel all their products and become some kind of bottom scraper.

Yes, because a reported operating loss of $2Billion according to their OWN figures isn't losing a lot of money? maybe it is you that requires the reality check, also, Sony do not want to play the N64 or Xbox role, they want market leadership, and have geared their business model to suit, if they sell 25Million units they will lose money, and it will not be pretty.

 

[ZeoVGM]

And by the way I'll let you in on a little secret: Sony is not nearly losing as much money with the PS3 as outside sources want to make you believe. These companies never do, they are not idiots. PS3 is not "high tech", it's a ****ing mass-produced consumer product. Blu Ray is not as expensive as they want to make you believe. It's the next ****ing iteration of a laser disc storage system, again mass produced consumer cheapware. The only high tech you get is in form of PR statements from the corporations. Guess why these products are so expensive at the beginning of the cycle? Huh? Yeah.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

 

[Kurosaki Ichigo]

Some important news from 6/14 final epic battle between los...I mean between PS3 and X360 :lol

- Bandai-Namco announces that 'Trusty Bell: Chopin no Yume' first shipment will be 70.000 units

- Tecmo and Enterbrain announce that 'Ninja Gaiden Sigma' demo on the japanese PS Store has been downloaded more than 100.000 times

 

[Kafel]

- Tecmo and Enterbrain announce that 'Ninja Gaiden Sigma' demo on the japanese PS Store has been downloaded more than 100.000 times

Did this demo appear on JP PSN before US and PAL PSN ?

 

[Parl]

Some important news from 6/14 final epic battle between los...I mean between PS3 and X360 :lol

- Bandai-Namco announces that 'Trusty Bell: Chopin no Yume' first shipment will be 70.000 units

- Tecmo and Enterbrain announce that 'Ninja Gaiden Sigma' demo on the japanese PS Store has been downloaded more than 100.000 times

Can we have some data on how much 360 has bumped from previous notable releases (the hardware sales for the week and the weeks before), the sales of such titles in the same week, and the time of year along with any other relevant data.

And also the same for the PS3.

 

[justjohn]

Some important news from 6/14 final epic battle between los...I mean between PS3 and X360 :lol

- Bandai-Namco announces that 'Trusty Bell: Chopin no Yume' first shipment will be 70.000 units

- Tecmo and Enterbrain announce that 'Ninja Gaiden Sigma' demo on the japanese PS Store has been downloaded more than 100.000 times

awesome. sigma will do some decent numbers, then the following week folks soul will be released, so i expect ps3 numbers to go up in the next few weeks.

 

[Tf53]

Do we have any evidence on demo downloads' correlation with game sales? How many of those people are likely to buy the game?

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Do we have any evidence on demo downloads' correlation with game sales? How many of those people are likely to buy the game?

In Ninja Gaiden's case, I'm sure half of the Japanese downloaders got to Murai and said "I'm not buying this ****, too hard".

 

[Evlar]

The most expensive single component in the PS3 is Cell and the motherboard that supports it. I haven't heard anything about a sizable decrease in the production cost of Cell.

 

[AdmiralViscen]

So you guys who think Sony will be just marching on no matter what, you actually believe in thins:

Sony releases game X and loses 20 million in costs and marketing. Sequel for X is approved.
Sony releases game Y and loses 20 million in costs and marketing. Sequel for Y is approved.
Sony releases game Z and loses 20 million in costs and marketing. Sequel for Z is approved.

No, I just think its first full year isn't even half over yet. And you think Resistance lost 20 million?!



btw guys

Remember when I took that poll about whether Wiitard or that gcnfan2k6 guy should be banned?

We voted right, dudes.

 

[SouthernDragon]

One moment of insanity doesn't make him a bad choice.

And, wait, so Sony is really losing only a few dollars per unit, instead of hundreds? Thank goodness, then. Those financial reports must have been red herrings on Sony's part, so that when we see the real reports, everyone will be relieved.

 

[Deku]

This discussion has suddenly taken a turn for the interesting. From crazy compare PS3 to previous gen loser consoles to infuriate Sony fannuts to crazier PS3 price talk from said funnuts. $200 drop in price imminent.

 

[milanbaros]

What predicted sales do you think Sony was working with in its business model? I don't they anticipated N64 or Xbox like sales. I think it turns out like that they will lose a lot of money.

 

[Brofist]

This discussion has suddenly taken a turn for the interesting. From crazy compare PS3 to previous gen loser consoles to infuriate Sony fannuts to crazier PS3 price talk from said funnuts. $200 drop in price imminent.

It was already beyond interesting when people started suggesting the PS3 will be canceled within a year from now :lol The rest was just icing.

 

[Sharp]

This discussion has suddenly taken a turn for the interesting. From crazy compare PS3 to previous gen loser consoles to infuriate Sony fannuts to crazier PS3 price talk from said funnuts. $200 drop in price imminent.

Yeah, the imminent price drop is obvious with this last piece of the puzzle. I don't know why you guys are arguing; you'd have to be a fool not to believe in Smiling Bandit's secret knowledge. A fool.

 

[Epigamic]

Wow @ Wiitard

I'm not going to argue that the outlook is currently rosy for Sony and the PS3 but I would be shocked if they pulled the plug.

You want a business reason to not pull the plug? The future revenue from PS4 and subsequent consoles.

 

[JJConrad]

Conrad sony can't kill the features of PS3 to cut cost, but the BR drive, ram, HDD, and gpu will keep those costs up for quite sometime. The areas that need to be made more cost effecient aren't really solvable by any practical means besides time. Hopefully after this generation console manufacturers will be much smarter about developing the tech in a console to a very bad mindset that niche elements of the bases want because they are too cheap and dumb to get a HTPC. PS3 would've been in my room now if it weren't price nothing else is holding me back.

I'd imagine that there are still a lot of corners they could cut and components that they could outsource. For example, they could pull the HDD and replace it with the cheapest one they can get or remove it all together. Or sell off the rights to Cell in a deal to get the proccessor cheaper. And I wonder if droppping BluRay movie playback (not the format, the movies) could save them some money and allow them to undersell other Bluray players without complications. I understand that this would absolutely piss off the hardcore market, but who cares? Pandering to that crowd got them where they are and its not like they are exactly embracing the system to begin with... they've got at least 3 million "hardcore" PS3's left over to choose from. After manufacturing costs come down to reasonable levels they can always reintroduce those lost features.

The bottom line is that they must drastically lower the MSRP and production costs now. If Sony does one without the other they'll either fall even further behind or either jeopardize the entire corporation. The first round of price cuts will happen this year, maybe even as soon as E3... they don't time to wait for component prices to drop naturally.

 

[Kosma]

Ok so Forza and Trusty Bell are about to hit Japan, when will we see the hardware and software numbers for that week?

 

[nli10]

I expect a high proportion of the people who cry 'price drop' do so because they themselves would like a PS3 but not at that price. It pretty much vindicates Sony's descision to stand by their guns. Also as historically price drops have only helped console sales in the short term and only adding value to the console (more and better games, improved features) has ever helped long term sales I see them waiting out the summer and then dropping the price just before the Xmas season (October/November probably).

 

[Brofist]

Ok so Forza and Trusty Bell are about to hit Japan, when will we see the hardware and software numbers for that week?

Trusty Bell comes out this Thursday, so it will show up in the 6/11-6/17 topic. I really think it may sell though almost 100%. On most online retail outlets it's showing very high in sales ranks (no. 2 on Amazon Japan behind only Zelda for DS). Forza 2 has been out, it debuted at 11.

 

[Sharp]

I can't read as usual.

 

[Deku]

Forza is already out. It sold about 10k copies.

 

[Threi]

wow wiitard is ****ing nuts :lol

 

[Parl]

wow wiitard is ****ing nuts :lol

Yeah, isn't he just.

I'm gonna go more nuts and talk about Harvest Moon Wii sales in a Media Create thread.

First week sales:

2007.02.01 [NDS] Harvest Moon: The Island I Grew Up On - 70,980
2006.08.24 [NDS] Rune Factory: Fantasy Harvest Moon - 39,973
2005.12.08 [NDS] Harvest Moon DS for Girls - 13,000
2005.11.10 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Magical Melody - 3,603
2005.03.17 [NDS] Harvest Moon DS - 22,026
2005.03.03 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Poem of Happiness - 19,394
2004.07.08 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Another Wonderful Life - 13,301
2003.12.12 [GBA] Harvest Moon: More Friends of Mineral Town - 10,757
2003.09.12 [GCN] Harvest Moon: A Wonderful Life - 26,130
2003.04.18 [GBA] Harvest Moon: Friends of Mineral Town - 20,520

Wii version at 15k, first day. That really so bad?

 

[Fuzzy]

Wii version at 15k, first day. That really so bad?

Not really since third party games don't sell on Nintendo consoles any way.

 

[Wiitard]

Hey guys!

So let me just understand what is the non-nuts position:


1) Sony will continue with the current levels of harware subsidiation in the next years: losing in the neighborhood of $100 for every system sold in the US and $200 for every system sold in Japan. Later the losses will be smaller. But in price will be signinificantly lower then cost in US and Japan till the end of generation;

2) When the price of 360 premium reaches $300, Sony might actually increase their losses per console and cut prices;

3) They will maintain a first party the size of Ubisoft for the rest of the generation.

4) They will be doing all that so as to have a sales disaster with at best 15-20 million install base as the launchpad for PS4, rather then a sales disaster with 8-10 million install base, because those 7-10 extra million bought at the cost of billions of dollars lost at hardware plus first party will make all the difference.

 

[SovanJedi]

Yeah, isn't he just.

I'm gonna go more nuts and talk about Harvest Moon Wii sales in a Media Create thread.

First week sales:

2007.02.01 [NDS] Harvest Moon: The Island I Grew Up On - 70,980
2006.08.24 [NDS] Rune Factory: Fantasy Harvest Moon - 39,973
2005.12.08 [NDS] Harvest Moon DS for Girls - 13,000
2005.11.10 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Magical Melody - 3,603
2005.03.17 [NDS] Harvest Moon DS - 22,026
2005.03.03 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Poem of Happiness - 19,394
2004.07.08 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Another Wonderful Life - 13,301
2003.12.12 [GBA] Harvest Moon: More Friends of Mineral Town - 10,757
2003.09.12 [GCN] Harvest Moon: A Wonderful Life - 26,130
2003.04.18 [GBA] Harvest Moon: Friends of Mineral Town - 20,520

Wii version at 15k, first day. That really so bad?

First of all, holy shishkebab I did not realise there were so many Harvest Moon games released in the last 5 years.

Secondly I think that doesn't really mean such bad things for the Wii version in light of the other sales. Of course with the number of games released people might just not care for the series like they used to.

 

[Eteric Rice]

First of all, holy shishkebab I did not realise there were so many Harvest Moon games released in the last 5 years.

Secondly I think that doesn't really mean such bad things for the Wii version in light of the other sales. Of course with the number of games released people might just not care for the series like they used to.

That, and the GCN, DS, GBA all probably had bigger pool of consumers at the time. So it sounds like the Wii HM has done what you'd expect from a HM title. It'll probably sell more as time goes on, too.

 

[AdmiralViscen]

One moment of insanity doesn't make him a bad choice.

And, wait, so Sony is really losing only a few dollars per unit, instead of hundreds? Thank goodness, then. Those financial reports must have been red herrings on Sony's part, so that when we see the real reports, everyone will be relieved.

We chose Wiitard for the banning.

He's insane 90% of the time. GCNdude was a genuine, bright-eyed fan. Wiitard is a caustic troll.

 

[Eteric Rice]

We chose Wiitard for the banning.

He's insane 90% of the time. GCNdude was a genuine, bright-eyed fan. Wiitard is a caustic troll.

What ever happened to GCNdude? He seemed like an okay guy.

From what I saw of his posts, anyway.

 

[AdmiralViscen]

What ever happened to GCNdude? He seemed like an okay guy.

From what I saw of his posts, anyway.

He got banned :lol

 

[Eteric Rice]

He got banned :lol

Lol, forever? What did he do to warrent a ban forever? :lol

 

[Segata Sanshiro]

Lol, forever? What did he do to warrent a ban forever? :lol

He must have really, really annoyed a mod who finds stupidity annoying.

 

[Epigamic]

Hey guys!

So let me just understand what is the non-nuts position:


1) Sony will continue with the current levels of harware subsidiation in the next years: losing in the neighborhood of $100 for every system sold in the US and $200 for every system sold in Japan. Later the losses will be smaller. But in price will be signinificantly lower then cost in US and Japan till the end of generation;

2) When the price of 360 premium reaches $300, Sony might actually increase their losses per console and cut prices;

3) They will maintain a first party the size of Ubisoft for the rest of the generation.

4) They will be doing all that so as to have a sales disaster with at best 15-20 million install base as the launchpad for PS4, rather then a sales disaster with 8-10 million install base, because those 7-10 extra million bought at the cost of billions of dollars lost at hardware plus first party will make all the difference.

My non-nuts position is that Sony will continue to support the PS3 while trying to reduce costs as much as possible.

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

Hey guys!

So let me just understand what is the non-nuts position:


1) Sony will continue with the current levels of harware subsidiation in the next years: losing in the neighborhood of $100 for every system sold in the US and $200 for every system sold in Japan. Later the losses will be smaller. But in price will be signinificantly lower then cost in US and Japan till the end of generation;

2) When the price of 360 premium reaches $300, Sony might actually increase their losses per console and cut prices;

3) They will maintain a first party the size of Ubisoft for the rest of the generation.

4) They will be doing all that so as to have a sales disaster with at best 15-20 million install base as the launchpad for PS4, rather then a sales disaster with 8-10 million install base, because those 7-10 extra million bought at the cost of billions of dollars lost at hardware plus first party will make all the difference.

I think Sony fully intends to eek out a living at $400 for the better part of this generation, at least through 2009. At that price point I think they could easily sell as well as MS did their first year, which would put them well on pace for 25 mil+ by the end of the generation. It's absurd to think that component costs for Blu Ray, Cell, won't fall over that time, and the addition of the 65nm processors won't hurt either.

Their first party studios won't be going anywhere - they are the biggest moneymakers on the platform, they learned that model from Nintendo. Annual regurgitations of Singstar and the like to a userbase of 10 million plus is good start to making ends meet.

8-10 million, given holiday bumps, Gundabumps, and a probable price drop/sales spike is not out of the question for next Spring (10 million is probably the max they could realistically achieve by then). Yes, it would be much, much worse for the PS4 if Sony were to drop their new console 2 years after its launch, it would be Dreamcast all over again. The PS3 isn't going anywhere, at least until 2010.

 

[schuelma]

Yeah, isn't he just.

I'm gonna go more nuts and talk about Harvest Moon Wii sales in a Media Create thread.

First week sales:

2007.02.01 [NDS] Harvest Moon: The Island I Grew Up On - 70,980
2006.08.24 [NDS] Rune Factory: Fantasy Harvest Moon - 39,973
2005.12.08 [NDS] Harvest Moon DS for Girls - 13,000
2005.11.10 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Magical Melody - 3,603
2005.03.17 [NDS] Harvest Moon DS - 22,026
2005.03.03 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Poem of Happiness - 19,394
2004.07.08 [GCN] Harvest Moon: Another Wonderful Life - 13,301
2003.12.12 [GBA] Harvest Moon: More Friends of Mineral Town - 10,757
2003.09.12 [GCN] Harvest Moon: A Wonderful Life - 26,130
2003.04.18 [GBA] Harvest Moon: Friends of Mineral Town - 20,520

Wii version at 15k, first day. That really so bad?

Thanks a lot for finding those numbers. Puts the 15K first day nicely into perspective.

 

[Evlar]

I think Sony fully intends to eek out a living at $400 for the better part of this generation, at least through 2009. At that price point I think they could easily sell as well as MS did their first year, which would put them well on pace for 25 mil+ by the end of the generation. It's absurd to think that component costs for Blu Ray, Cell, won't fall over that time, and the addition of the 65nm processors won't hurt either.

Their first party studios won't be going anywhere - they are the biggest moneymakers on the platform, they learned that model from Nintendo. Annual regurgitations of Singstar and the like to a userbase of 10 million plus is good start to making ends meet.

8-10 million, given holiday bumps, Gundabumps, and a probable price drop/sales spike is not out of the question for next Spring (10 million is probably the max they could realistically achieve by then). Yes, it would be much, much worse for the PS4 if Sony were to drop their new console 2 years after its launch, it would be Dreamcast all over again. The PS3 isn't going anywhere, at least until 2010.

I don't want to be lumped in with the crazies here but I have to ask... How much does Sony net from their first-party studios?

 

[Fuzzy]

Wiitard
Banned

GAF has lost another great poster.