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[Shake Your Rump]

I do yes. I call you questionable.

Your recommended distance is 3.6 meters. But still not optimal.

My 85 inch is almost 4 meters.

But good luck sitting 1.6 from your screen as per your sites minimum distance.

With my qn95c 85 inch, if i would sit that close my retina would burn out as my screen peak brightness is 4000 nits.

Sorry, but their calculator is terribly useless. It recommends nine feet for a 65”? Almost eight feet for a 55”? Six feet from a 42”? It would feel like a postage stamp. Absurd.

All you have to do is scroll down and see that rtings themselves shows a chart with the usual recommendation of 8.5' (2.59 m) for an 85” TV.

Scroll down and see their own chart that shows the 4K isn’t even “worth it” on a 85” at four meters.

People will sit at one end or the other of the viewing distance range. It’s unfair to blame the user’s seating distance for obvious shortcomings of the current upscaling implementation.

 

[gooner4life_uk]

So I should get an accurate readout when turning off HFR? Ok I'll try that.

Also, in Bloodborne the overlay shows me locked 60 fps... that game has no HFR setting, what gives?

30fps doubled is 60fps, it's why your input lag is higher in 30fps games.

 

[Bartski]

30fps doubled is 60fps, it's why your input lag is higher in 30fps games.

what I mean is what should I do so the C2 overlay shows me accurate fps

 

[Skitso]

Unless someone with a capture card is able to reproduce this then it's an issue with your TV (and one of your settings).

If I don't turn off all the AI image processing on my Philips OLED then I get issues that appear exactly like that. Are you sure you have all the AI image processing crap turned off?

It's not though. My TV has all processing and AI stuff disabled and it's also professionally Calman calibrated.

Is it really this hard to admit PSSR might actually not be the perfect upscaling tech it was hyped to be?

 

[Revolutionary]

I mean... DLSS is considered the best-in-class upscaling method but if you look close enough, you'll see imperfections too.

 

[Skitso]

I mean... DLSS is considered the best-in-class upscaling method but if you look close enough, you'll see imperfections too.

Yeah, I guess. I mean, PSSR is my first first-hand experience of these high end AI image reconstruction systems. I've seen DLSS before only in youtube videos and everyone says it's like magic so maybe I just expected more...

 

[buenoblue]

Now that I've had time to test a few PRO patched games, I have to admit the PSSR resolved image has quite a lot of negatives on top of all the positives like sharper image with more visible detail. I play with a 83" LG C1 with about 3m viewing distance, so the screen is large, but still - I can't help but feel dissapointed with the amount of shimmering and pixel crawl in almost all the games I've tested (SM2, TLOU1 and 2) Sure, there was some of it before, but it seems to be a really common issue now with PSSR, which I thought would have removed almost all this kind of image quality issues. Now it seems I just have a sharper image but a less stable one.

Am I the only one suffering from this? What are your personal experience of PSSR image stability and quality?

Yeah for 83 inch your gonna need a 4090 pc

 

[Lysandros]

Yeah, I guess. I mean, PSSR is my first first-hand experience of these high end AI image reconstruction systems. I've seen DLSS before only in youtube videos and everyone says it's like magic so maybe I just expected more...

Neither reconstruction solution is perfect. Based on Rift Apart comparison PSSR has even a few advantages over DLSS. Again, the main problem i am seeing is that the default sharpening pass is too strong. It's to the developer to tweak or disable it. Or it should be optional rather than default. I also hate an over sharpened, unstable image by the way, so get your sensitivity.

 

[Donald mac Ronald]

I'm curious what the pro could do without using any upscaler ai .

Just using it's Raw power.

 

[Killer8]

This is a z-fighting issue unrelated to PSSR.

 

[Shake Your Rump]

what I mean is what should I do so the C2 overlay shows me accurate fps

It is accurately showing you the display framerate. It cannot know the game framerate. If the console is outputting 60hz, that is what it will show. If it is outputting 120hz, that is what it will show. The only time it will vary, is if the game and console are using VRR.

Bloodborne renders at 30fps, but is output in the usual NTSC 60hz mode. The TV display will always show 60 (or 59).

 

[bundylove]

Sorry, but their calculator is terribly useless. It recommends nine feet for a 65”? Almost eight feet for a 55”? Six feet from a 42”? It would feel like a postage stamp. Absurd.

All you have to do is scroll down and see that rtings themselves shows a chart with the usual recommendation of 8.5' (2.59 m) for an 85” TV.

Scroll down and see their own chart that shows the 4K isn’t even “worth it” on a 85” at four meters.

People will sit at one end or the other of the viewing distance range. It’s unfair to blame the user’s seating distance for obvious shortcomings of the current upscaling implementation.

there is a big difference from an oled to a neo qled or mini led.

As mentioned, peak brightness is key here.
I say good luck sitting 8 feet in front of 85 inch 4000 plus nits. It can be too much for my eye.

Also resolution is a factor. 4k 85 inch at 8 feet looks worse than 8k so viewing distance for better viewing image qualiry has to be adjusted.

No tv enthusiast will sit nose to the screen its like going to the movies and have to sit first row

 

[Skitso]

This is a z-fighting issue unrelated to PSSR.

It's not. It's sub pixel shimmering.

 

[Skitso]

there is a big difference from an oled to a neo qled or mini led.

As mentioned, peak brightness is key here.
I say good luck sitting 8 feet in front of 85 inch 4000 plus nits. It can be too much for my eye.

Also resolution is a factor. 4k 85 inch at 8 feet looks worse than 8k so viewing distance for better viewing image qualiry has to be adjusted.

No tv enthusiast will sit nose to the screen its like going to the movies and have to sit first row.

This is false - at least when consuming 4k or lower resolution content. Nothing beats native (except downsampling). 4K to 4k will always look better than 4K to 8K. And the farther away you go from native, the worse the picture will be. 1080p to 4K will look better than 1080p to 8K. I would not trust TV manufacturer's upscaling software to make the conversion. Especially in gaming.

Also, who has said they are sitting nose to the screen? I don't have 3,1m long nose the last time I measured it.

Seating distance in relation to your screen brightness is just silly talk too.

 

[Hugare]

It's the first version of a new tech for Sony

People thinking it would suddenly be better than DLSS are lunatics

 

[bundylove]

This is false - at least when consuming 4k or lower resolution content. Nothing beats native (except downsampling). 4K to 4k will always look better than 4K to 8K. And the farther away you go from native, the worse the picture will be. 1080p to 4K will look better than 1080p to 8K. I would not trust TV manufacturer's upscaling software to make the conversion. Especially in gaming.

Also, who has said they are sitting nose to the screen? I don't have 3,1m long nose the last time I measured it.

Seating distance in relation to your screen brightness is just silly talk too.

Sir , you will never sit 8 feet from my tv and say wow what an experience. No sir you wont see nothing as you will keep wiping your eyes from the sun called tv.
You want to ruin your eyes thats your problem.

The point is none of these values apply to real life and not ever since the tv space became all about peak brightness where everyone is trying to up another at the expense of our health.

No the latest hisense tvs upscale greatly from 4k to 8k with denser ppi which will help with the image by sitting closer.

My tv cost 5k and i still can see individual pixels when close.

Look all good here, this is first world problems most cant even relate to on this forum given most dont go beyond 65.

My pro is arriving today, fuck you amazon, and then i will report back how the IQ is compared to the base ps5.
If its really that much better then you are right. Sitting closer wont matter.

 

[GHG]

It's not. It's sub pixel shimmering.

If you're claiming this then it's something that would possibly only resolve on OLED screens due to their sub-pixel arrangememts.

It's not though. My TV has all processing and AI stuff disabled and it's also professionally Calman calibrated.

It was a simple question based on my experience with both of my LG and Philips OLED sets, although I don't have a pro so I'm unable to test how PSSR resolves on them, the only time I've seen the kind of thing you're showing in the video (whether it's native, DLAA, or DLSS being used) is when I've forgotten to turn the AI processing stuff off after watching TV/movies.

Is it really this hard to admit PSSR might actually not be the perfect upscaling tech it was hyped to be?

However, when you start phrasing things like this then it becomes abundantly clear that you have an agenda. Account since 2020, only 133 posts and you're talking like this. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it must be a darkmage.

I wish you well on your endeavours.

 

[Skitso]

Sir , you will never sit 8 feet from my tv and say wow what an experience. No sir you wont see nothing as you will keep wiping your eyes from the sun called tv.

Do you need to have your TV set so bright? That sounds really uncomfortable?

Not sure about games, but movies are mostly mastered at 1000 nits and there are literally only a handful on movies that are mastered to higher than that.

I get you want your HDR peaks to be super bright, but the whole screen? And all the time?

 

[bundylove]

If you're claiming this then it's something that would possibly only resolve on OLED screens due to their sub-pixel arrangememts.



It was a simple question based on my experience with both of my LG and Philips OLED sets, although I don't have a pro so I'm unable to test how PSSR resolves on them, the only time I've seen the kind of thing you're showing in the video (whether it's native, DLAA, or DLSS being used) is when I've forgotten to turn the AI processing stuff off after watching TV/movies.



However, when you start phrasing things like this then it becomes abundantly clear that you have an agenda. Account since 2020, only 133 posts and you're talking like this. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it must be a darkmage.

I wish you well on your endeavours.

I wouldnt go there. Pointing out accounts git me several warnings.

But i want to solve this one mystery.
Hiw come i see so many low count accounts that are years old with mesdages in the hundreds max but they are all gold accounts?
They just pay fof gold on a dormant or not at all used account? Someone please help me out here

 

[Skitso]

However, when you start phrasing things like this then it becomes abundantly clear that you have an agenda. Account since 2020, only 133 posts and you're talking like this. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it must be a darkmage.

Are you spinning this into a console war or did I understand you wrong?

And how are my post numbers of any relevance here?

I'm mostly a lurker but buying a pro gave me a reason to post. Sorry to do that.

 

[bundylove]

Do you need to have your TV set so bright? That sounds really uncomfortable?

Not sure about games, but movies are mostly mastered at 1000 nits and tjere are literally only a handful on movies that are mastered to higher than that.

I get you want your HDR peaks to be super bright, but the whole screen? And all the time?

Some shows in hdr10 plus can be fucking brutal. When there are light sources on the screen they can be too much or awitching from dark to bright scenes. The foundation firat season had a lot of those.

In games it can be too much sometimes. Ragnarok was a prime example. But then again it was perfect in dead space.

My settings for movies are as per site recommendatiins but for games i turned on contrast enhancer as otherwise the screen is dull and washed out. With contrast enhancer on low i get perfect colors and brightness but can be too much sometimes.

 

[GHG]

Are you spinning this into a console war or did I understand you wrong?

You should ask yourself the very same question when you're the one who is suggesting the following:

Is it really this hard to admit PSSR might actually not be the perfect upscaling tech it was hyped to be?

-----

I wouldnt go there. Pointing out accounts git me several warnings.

But i want to solve this one mystery.
Hiw come i see so many low count accounts that are years old with mesdages in the hundreds max but they are all gold accounts?
They just pay fof gold on a dormant or not at all used account? Someone please help me out here

When the patterns are so consistent it becomes painfully obvious.

 

[Skitso]

You should ask yourself the very same question when you're the one who is suggesting the following:

When the patterns are so consistent it becomes painfully obvious.

Ah, sorry I didn't understand that if I own a certain plastic box, I need to unconditionally love every single aspect of it.

 

[K' Dash]

with a TV of that size and sitting close to it, of course you're detailing all the blemishes...

Also, PSSR is not magic and it's not better than Nvidias solution.

 

[twilo99]

However, when you start phrasing things like this then it becomes abundantly clear that you have an agenda. Account since 2020, only 133 posts and you're talking like this. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it must be a darkmage.

I wish you well on your endeavours.

Not everyone who you disagree with has an "agenda"

 

[GHG]

Ah, sorry I didn't understand that if I own a certain plastic box, I need to unconditionally love every single aspect of it.

Yep, that question you asked, ask it again, but to yourself this time.

Not everyone who you disagree with has an "agenda"

I never actually disagreed with him.

And in principle, I agree with your statement, just not coming from you.

 

[Skitso]

Yep, that question you asked, ask it again, but to yourself this time.



I never actually disagreed with him.

And in principle, I agree with your statement, just not coming from you.

Hopefully I can buy an authorization from you to criticize PSSR with this.

 

[Variahunter]

It's not exactly pssr related but all LG OLED a should have sharpening at 0.

Honestly it really depends on the game and also the internal resolution.
Sometimes sharpening on top of a really high resolution can show new details that are blurred otherwise.

But I play on PC on 4K with DLSS, so I don't often encounter that shimmering.

 

[NEbeast]

I Agree. I think I just personally prefer consistently average image over almost perfect image where certain issues stick out like a sore thumb. Hmm.. Dunno, maybe I'm overreacting and just looking too much for faults.

 

[octos]

The PS5 pro actually has fewer IQ issues than the PS5, but now those IQ issues are more apparent because before, you had pixel crawling on the whole image, but now it's only in a few spots, making those spots stick out more.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

I think you can really see the difference with PiSSeR vs FSR when it comes to hair detail and foliage. Other stuff not as much, but it is really great how it improves FSR's shit coverage on hair.

Yes, it pisses all over FSR's hair

 

[bundylove]

So now that i had the chance to play around with it i must say there are some major issues with pssr. In jedi survivor in performance mode it looks worse than base ps5. There are also a lot of glitches on aplha effects and severe shimmer and blurriness.

Alan wake has tons of alliasing but at least the image is stable unlike jedi. Hogwarts looks decent but i cant compare since i only downloaded it now on the pro.

Am i the only one? Also there shold be more info in the games graphics settings so i know what i get.

 

[digital_ghost]

I had IQ issues. That's why I was a special education kid.

 

[Skitso]

Am i the only one?

Well, obviously you are not. This is exactly what I've been shouting here...

 

[bundylove]

Well, obviously you are not. This is exactly what I've been shouting here...

Fucking horrible . Silent hill 2 is even worse then ever before. The fuck?

 

[Crayon]

Upgrade to a smaller tv.

 

[Orpheus]

I wouldnt go there. Pointing out accounts git me several warnings.

But i want to solve this one mystery.
Hiw come i see so many low count accounts that are years old with mesdages in the hundreds max but they are all gold accounts?
They just pay fof gold on a dormant or not at all used account? Someone please help me out here

You have exactly one warning for going on an unhinged rant calling out "cunts" and "retards". Let's just leave it at that and you worry about you.

 

[Team Andromeda]

It's nice for a 1st try TBF. It makes the tyre smoke in F1 look hideous mind

 

[Skitso]

Upgrade to a smaller tv.

No thanks.

 

[FeralEcho]

It's not though. My TV has all processing and AI stuff disabled and it's also professionally Calman calibrated.

Is it really this hard to admit PSSR might actually not be the perfect upscaling tech it was hyped to be?

Are you new to GAF PS5 threads? It's filled with the usual suspects that can't admit there's something wrong with their plastic box even if their life depends on it. It's embarassing...

Instead of people discussing the issue this thread has devolved into a discussion of how you must not have your tv calibrated properly or measurements on how far you have to sit from the tv to not notice the issues.

What's next guys?! Shall we make an appointment at the eye doctor for OP?

Pathetic,it reminds me of the Xbox one days where people were defending 720p saying you won't notice the difference between it and 1080p if you sit far enough away from the TV. Bullshit then and bullshit now.

It's the reason I tend to stay away from Pro focused threads nowadays,it has become an echo chamber.

 

[Skifi28]

Can't say I've experienced any issues with PSSR in particular. After the DF coverage I was expecting a bit on instability as they said, but I've yet to notice anything significant and I play with my head pressed against a monitor. Of course that's not to sat it's perfect, in Rebirth for example I can notice the occasional shimmering when it comes to very thin lines or metal grates on the ground at weird angles, but that always goes with the territory of reconstruction from a low res and even DLSS is not perfect in the year or so I've been using it. Overally, I've come away really impressed with what they cooked for their first effort. If you were to directly show me a DLSS vs PSSR comparison on the same games, I don't think I could tell you which is which.

 

[winjer]

Fucking horrible . Silent hill 2 is even worse then ever before. The fuck?

That is due to Lumen. For some weird reason, the devs choose to use dynamic lighting for this game, that really didn't need it.

 

[Inviusx]

I might be wrong but I feel like this "shimmering" effect is related to RTGI, or Lumen on UE5. The effect is present in Snowdrop titles as well like Avatar and Outlaws.

 

[Bojji]

That is due to Lumen. For some weird reason, the devs choose to use dynamic lighting for this game, that really didn't need it.

But this wouldn't explain why PS5 version is more stable.

 

[winjer]

But this wouldn't explain why PS5 version is more stable.

Higher resolutions have the "benefit" of making some problems more visible.

 

[Quezacolt]

Higher resolutions have the "benefit" of making some problems more visible.

Or it could simply be a bug. I still have to test it, but i saw some people saying that with the 1.0 build from the disc, the game doesn't have that problem on the Pro.

 

[adamsapple]

Fucking horrible . Silent hill 2 is even worse then ever before. The fuck?

Hmmm, that's definitely not normal.

Just took these from my PS5 and while you can notice some minor shadow artifacts, it is nowhere near as egregious as those gifs.


If the embeds below don't work, you can see them by clicking here.

 

[skneogaf]

I have the same tv and I think it looks great, I don't see any issues.

The clarity improvement on things like grass in the last of us part 2 is amazing.

 

[sachos]

That chart is amazing. I wonder how many people actually sit at the optimal viewing distance (the ligth blue line). When i do for my 4K Tv the difference is huge. You really do start "loosing" detail really fast as you start moving backwards.
Other thing i like to do is get really close to the display as to actually see the pixel grid, then start slowly moving backwards until i cant see the grid anymore.

 

[Zathalus]

Hmmm, that's definitely not normal.

Just took these from my PS5 and while you can notice some minor shadow artifacts, it is nowhere near as egregious as those gifs.


If the embeds below don't work, you can see them by clicking here.

It’s likely PSSR mucking it up. ML based upscalers like PSSR/DLSS/XeSS are not always fire and forget. Developers need to actually address any issues that crop up when using these upscalers. Usually there are no or minor issues but every so often you get problems like these.

While PSSR has some minor issues with stability, this example is rather egregious and is on the developer to solve.