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[TrebleShot]

It doesn't actually reinforce your point at all. Considering a single use case is looking at this from a narrow point of view. Let me be more specific, no developer is using a 4090 to create a 30 FPS experience that some gamer's don't mind. Highend GPUs like the 4090 can can be used to push resolution, ray tracing, textures, foliage, etc...to its highest* potential at a respectively frame rate beyond 60 FPS. Pushing high frame rates on consoles comes at a cost. This usually entails degraded textures, lower resolution, lack of ray tracing, reduced graphical effects, reduced foliage, and so on.

That proves the point that improved hard ware is needed to achieve higher fidelity beyond 30fps and therefore the pro is needed. Glad we’re on the same page.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I get a kick out of the posters that run in with the "what would the purpose be?" or "why?" posts. I guess they've never been in the threads when games release with a 30fps cap.

Makes me scratch my head too like every game is running 4k 120 with RT

 

[SentientStone]

In if true, hopping on mid-get refreshes will be my thing going forward.
I also said this last gen and ended up not hopping on at all. :/

 

[TheRedRiders]

No. That Cerny RT Patent is about new accelerating RT hardware possibly as good as Nvidia RT tech. The patent is actually describing what's in RDNA2 as a reference but then describes plenty more hardware units to accelerate things that are currently done via software on RDNA2 GPUs.

Can you please point me to the parts where it specifically makes mention of new hardware units, as far as I can see it's just describing the software side of things when it comes to RT.

 

[BrutalTruth_]

Playstation Vita flop 15 Million
Gamecube flop 21,74 Mio
Not sure about N64. I think it also counted as flop. 32,93 Million
Dreamcast flop 9,13 Million
Wii U flop 13,56 Million
Xbox flop 25 Million

GameCube, N64 and Xbox aren't flops, they weren't going to dethrone PS1 and PS2.

 

[Spyxos]

GameCube, N64 and Xbox aren't flops, they weren't going to dethrone PS1 and PS2.

Source? This is the first time I've heard that they haven't flopped.

 

[onQ123]

If it’s shipping next year developers would have kits now.

Not true for pro models they only need to patch the games to run on the new models

 

[Physiognomonics]

Can you please point me to the parts where it specifically makes mention of new hardware units, as far as I can see it's just describing the software side of things when it comes to RT.

Figure 300 is about describing what's in RDNA2 which has only intersection engine hardware.
Figure 400 shows the added hardware units: traversal logic, stack management and unspecified others (on top of the existing intersection engine that is still there).
The new hardware units are talked about in the summary and in the whole thing. The summary contains a pretty clear explanation. Notice "adapted to traverse".

one or more hardware-implemented ray tracing units (RTU) adapted to traverse an acceleration structure to calculate intersections of rays with bounding volumes and graphics primitives asynchronously with shader operation.

https://data.epo.org/publication-server/document?iDocId=6759906&iFormat=0

 

[BrutalTruth_]

Source? This is the first time I've heard that they haven't flopped.

Where's your source? I've never seen them get called flops.

You really think the N64 was a flop?

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

A Slim mode is plausible, but I still have my doubts about a Pro model. I think it’s a waste of time and resources if this is legitimate. Besides, more money what’s really the point of the PS5 Pro when very few games after all this time barely take advantage of the PS5? Hey guys, now you can play those increased resolution PS4-quality games at a non-fluctuating 60 or even 120fps now. That will be $600-800, please.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

A Slim mode is plausible, but I still have my doubts about a Pro model. I think it’s a waste of time and resources if this is legitimate. Besides, more money what’s really the point of the PS5 Pro when very few games after all this time barely take advantage of the PS5? Hey guys, now you can play those increased resolution PS4-quality games at a non-fluctuating 60 or even 120fps now. That will be $600-800, please.

Rock solid 60 or 120 fps? For $600-$800?

 

[Kokoloko85]

Day 1 but how about some more next gen exclusives.
This gen has been slow on next gen only games

 

[Spyxos]

Where's your source? I've never seen them get called flops.

You really think the N64 was a flop?

N64 that one i am not sure. Every gaming magazine in my country has described them as flops, and not just once, and for years to come.

Found on the short term.

Gamecube https://vocal.media/gamers/why-was-the-gamecube-considered-a-flop-when-it-is-so-widely-loved

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/features/gamecube-at-20/

https://goombastomp.com/marketing-gamecube-15-years-later-went-wrong/

 

[BrutalTruth_]

N64 that one i am not sure. Every gaming magazine in my country has described them as flops, and not just once, and for years to come.

Found on the short term.

Gamecube https://vocal.media/gamers/why-was-the-gamecube-considered-a-flop-when-it-is-so-widely-loved

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/features/gamecube-at-20/

https://goombastomp.com/marketing-gamecube-15-years-later-went-wrong/

Never heard of these sites in my life.

Gamecube is the only debatable one, as it was not as popular as the PS2 and Xbox at the time.

Xbox and N64 were not flops, Xbox did really well for being in the market for 4 years as a brand new console in the industry with no prior recognition.

 

[Spyxos]

Never heard of these sites in my life.

Gamecube is the only debatable one, as it was not as popular as the PS2 and Xbox at the time.

Xbox and N64 were not flops, Xbox did really well for being in the market for 4 years as a brand new console in the industry with no prior recognition.

Hmm I remember how the Xbox was torn apart in the German gaming media and was called a massive flop. Same with the Gamecube and Wii U. I read it so many times that I didn't question it anymore, but those numbers aren't great either.

 

[DownLikeBCPowder]

I'm starting to get into the market for a Ps5, but this doesn't sound all that appealing to me. Hearing "detachable disc drive" - I'd rather have it built in, so it sounds like I should just bite the bullet and get the regular model now. I don't really care about a little more power. I skipped the Ps4 pro, too. I was hoping to hold out for some kind of price cut, but seems like things got worse instead.

 

[Justin9mm]

From a logical point of view, this sounds like bullshit.. It would be a waste of money considering developers aren't even using the full capability of the PS5.

I blame the developers, they are holding the PS5 back and they probably would like a Pro so they can just brute force higher settings rather than properly optimise with current hardware. That would mean OG PS5 would get even less optimisation support.

 

[Polygonal_Sprite]

It’s not someone who wants better box. That someone will limit best features to thousands of dollars box.

Welcome to the current World of technology. Console generations were never going to last forever.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Never heard of these sites in my life.

Gamecube is the only debatable one, as it was not as popular as the PS2 and Xbox at the time.

Xbox and N64 were not flops, Xbox did really well for being in the market for 4 years as a brand new console in the industry with no prior recognition.

Xbox OG did 24M units which is pretty good for a first try. Also, the system cost more than PS2 and GC. Google says GC sold 21M which is lousy. Beat out by a VCR sized Xbox. That was Nintendo on their downward trend, but zoomed back up with Wii.

Given that Nintendo systems are always rock bottom somewhere in that $200-250 range at regular price, I find it amazing how low some of their consoles sell. The games must be such a turn off for gamers even a $199 price isnt enough to hook people in.

 

[Crispy Gamer]

Hopefully I can get a Witcher 3 60fps RT patch

 

[skit_data]

If all it’s gonna offer is higher resolution I will skip it, but if it allows 60fps in games when we evetually start seeing mostly 30fps again I will buy it unless it’s ridiculously expensive.

 

[ChiefDada]

I doubt it's true because the RDNA2 architeture is much better than the Jaguar architeture used for the XONE and PS4.

But most devs are too lazy to optimize games, so i can see them wanting a PS5 Pro.

Wait but Jaguar is CPU/RDNA GPU. And why do you doubt if you think developers would like mid-gen refresh?

 

[SegaSnatcher]

So as assumed, PS5 Pro with much better ray tracing capabilities. Cool, gonna sell my PS5 while I can still get like $399 for it lol.

 

[ManaByte]

Not true for pro models they only need to patch the games to run on the new models

No it’s true. The whole reason people found out about the PS4 Pro was because devs were blabbing about the new “Neo” dev kits at GDC the March before it came out.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

Wait but Jaguar is CPU/RDNA GPU.

Umm, what are you talking about? Jaguar is an old CPU core, nothing to do with RDNA.

 

[onQ123]

No it’s true. The whole reason people found out about the PS4 Pro was because devs were blabbing about the new “Neo” dev kits at GDC the March before it came out.

That was months not a whole year & a half

 

[El Pistolero]

I would not be shocked if this were to materialize, as there always has been a segment of gaming enthusiasts who are willing to acquire the new shiny box. My only issue with it has to do with the fact that introducing a Pro version halfway through the life cycle of the base console makes the transition to proper next-gen less impactful.

 

[EverydayBeast]

Good decision by Sony looks like pro versions will be around.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

Why are people even speculating if this will happen or not? Of course it will. I'm pretty sure the PS4 Pro did pretty well for an enthusiast SKU. They will want to keep this gen going as long as they can.

Also, don't expect Microsoft to let Sony get a whole year head start this time around.

 

[DonJimbo]

If its real i made the right decision to wait not like the PS4 Pro where i bought OG and then the Pro Version

 

[ChiefDada]

Umm, what are you talking about? Jaguar is an old CPU core, nothing to do with RDNA.

Lol did you not see what I was responding to?

 

[Airbus Jr]

 

[SegaSnatcher]

If its real i made the right decision to wait not like the PS4 Pro where i bought OG and then the Pro Version

You can literally sell for almost what you paid for it. My PS4 Pro and PS5 purchases were only $100 upgrades each time.

 

[KungFucius]

The PS5 Pro is the next Switch Pro. It was rumored for 2023 by some bullshitter. It is now rumored for late 2024 by some bullshitter and will probably start having more and more bullshitters drop some bullshit about a looming announcement that never materializes because it is fucking bullshit.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

The PS5 Pro is the next Switch Pro. It was rumored for 2023 by some bullshitter. It is now rumored for late 2024 by some bullshitter and will probably start having more and more bullshitters drop some bullshit about a looming announcement that never materializes because it is fucking bullshit.

The thing is there was a PS4 Pro and it seemed to work out for them. It's not unrealistic to think a PS5 Pro would come out 3 - 4 yrs after the launch model.

 

[unlurkified]

These are sorely needed already imo. Who’s happy with 4k/30 or 1440p/60? There’s only a handful of upgraded PS4 games that the PS5 can handle in 4k/60 like Borderlands 3. Bring on 4k/60 for actual current-gen games please.

 

[Kataploom]

What if AMD offered them a sweet deal considering they aren't selling CPUs and GPUs recently? I think there is not enough of a ballpark to make a console more powerful and cheap enough, and that Sony wouldn't win anything by releasing them, apart from reducing the profits per unit

 

[SegaSnatcher]

These are sorely needed already imo. Who’s happy with 4k/30 or 1440p/60? There’s only a handful of upgraded PS4 games that the PS5 can handle in 4k/60 like Borderlands 3. Bring on 4k/60 for actual current-gen games please.

I guarantee if I placed you in a seating position most people actually sit from their TV you wouldn't be able to pick apart well upscaled 4K from a lower resolution and native 4K. Native 4K is just a resource hog with very little improvement over well upscaled content from a lower res. Native 4K makes more sense in PC gaming applications when your face is basically right in front of the screen.

 

[SegaSnatcher]

For the people who want a pro concole, go buy a PC.

Comments like these are ignorant. A PC is not an option for people who like the console experience, plus a PC as powerful as a theoretical PS5 Pro would be way more expensive than the actual Pro.

Look how much it would cost just to make a PC equivelent of the current PS5. It's easily double.

 

[Hoddi]

I don't have any strong opinion. But we still don't know what kind of resolution drops to expect once proper next-gen games start coming out.

If 1080p becomes the norm then I can definitely see value in releasing Pro models. But it's also why I stuck with my old plasma.

 

[DonJimbo]

You can literally sell for almost what you paid for it. My PS4 Pro and PS5 purchases were only $100 upgrades each time.

Im a collector i dont sell my consoles

 

[Rykan]

30 FPS vs 60 FPS in current gen games? It's not so complicated.

It's not that complicated? 60 FPS is already the standard and present in nearly every game. Nearly every single current gen game, both cross gen and current gen, has 60 FPS modes. 60 FPS modes is clearly something that players want, and developers are unlikely to lock it behind a Pro model if it's a much desired feature.

Is this another one of those "Devs will surely go back to 30 FPS!" even when game after game continues to ship with 60 FPS modes because it's a highly requested feature?

This is exactly what the issue is with a pro model: It would promise features that were already used to promote the regular PS5.

Enthusiasts have money to spend and are willing to spend on higher level hardware.
Sony baked in a lot margin on the new Dualsense Edge. No reason why they can’t do it with a PS5 Pro.
PS5 Pro can add more users- think of the influx of used PS5s that will come to market. Cheaper entry point for owners on a budget.

Like me. Fuck 30fps.

There's a difference between an accessory and an entire new console.

I'm not saying there's no audience for this at all, but the PS5 is currently 500$ in the US and 550 euro in Europe. If the price difference between the Pro and the Regular model stays the same as PS4 Pro, then PS5 Pro will launch at probably 600$ ~ 650 Euro. Queue the 599 U S DOLLARS meme.

Even the PS4 pro didn't sell all that great, and that system had the benefit of being marketed at: "Here is a 4K system to go with your new 4K TV". PS5 Pro won't have that luxury, instead having to go with vague concepts like "Ray tracing ,but good this time" and "Better graphics!

Look at the difference in graphics between PS4 games and PS5 games that were cross gen. The difference really isn't that big, and that's like a 7 years difference. How big do you think the difference between systems that were released only 4 years apart could possibly be? It's going to be negligible at best. Developers aren't going to spend a lot of resources increasing graphical fidelity for a fraction of the user base that buys a Pro version.

 

[SolidQ]

How is RDNA 3 with RT?

 

[SoloKingRobert]

Didn't Sony just increased PS5 price few months ago? It wouldn't make sense releasing a PS5 Pro this year or next year.

 

[mckmas8808]

will series-s get a pro model too?
this whole idea of pro consoles is a clusterfuck

The idea of pro consoles is a god send. Because it's 100% optional.

 

[Iced Arcade]

Pro consoles... Making PC gaming not sound so expensive and making the thought much more appealing.

 

[PeteBull]

Pro consoles... Making PC gaming not sound so expensive and making the thought much more appealing.

Yup or u can do it like me, dont buy ps5/xsx as early adopter when barely any exclusives are there, and wait for pr0 models in 4-5th year of gen's life to get much better looking/performing games and access to much more exclusives by then ;D

 

[PeteBull]

Comments like these are ignorant. A PC is not an option for people who like the console experience, plus a PC as powerful as a theoretical PS5 Pro would be way more expensive than the actual Pro.

Look how much it would cost just to make a PC equivelent of the current PS5. It's easily double.

Indeed, and i already got a pc, strong pc too, with 3080ti which is at least 2x as powerful as current ps5/xsx, still will definitely want ps5pr0 on top for console experience/day one exclusives access, 2x ps5 power for 600 or even 800 bucks will be such a bargain.
https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-rx-6700-xt.c3695 btw thats desktop gpu superior to both ps5/xsx in every aspect, and it will easily stay that way over whole gen, if we getting 2x its power, very likely with rdna 4 architecture, end of 2024 or in 2025 we gonna get massive imrpovent in console space, suddenly games will look like in fidelity mode and perform in stable 60fps like in perfomance mode, aka we finally gonna get best of both words, no compromises =D

 

[Anchovie123]

Late 2024, does that mean RDNA4 would potentially be on the table? If so performance could honestly be in the ball park of a 7900 XT or even a XTX. Witch also means PS6 will likely release late 2028 with RDNA6. (If they're still going with that architecture & naming scheme.)

PS5 Slim = 399$
PS5 Pro = 599$

My guesses. Anything above 599$ would be iffy imo.

 

[mckmas8808]

Pro consoles... Making PC gaming not sound so expensive and making the thought much more appealing.

There's bigger differences between console gaming and PC gaming than just cost. Plus by it's very nature you'll spend more on PC gaming when it comes to hardware.